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Old 06-15-2005, 01:23 PM   #5601
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I'd hardly call him a joke. Everyone knows Alan Shearer will be the manager within 2 years anyway.
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Old 06-15-2005, 01:30 PM   #5602
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How exactly is Graeme Souness not a joke?

Alan Shearer would be another joke appointment. Just get a good fucking coach and tactician. He doesn't have to be a big name, or a legendary player. He just has to be able to get a team playing properly. They've had Keegan, Dalglish, Gullitt, Robson and now Souness, possibly Shearer next, all on name value. They should sack Souness, and get Paul Le Guen in before some other top side snaps him up.
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Old 06-15-2005, 01:33 PM   #5603
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Monday Morning
Didn't even know it was happening
lol @ you cunts not even caring

Cmon Wengerland, fire up son, Zagorakis is in Greece's team!
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Old 06-15-2005, 01:35 PM   #5604
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Quote:
Originally Posted by El Capitano Gatisto
How exactly is Graeme Souness not a joke?

Alan Shearer would be another joke appointment. Just get a good fucking coach and tactician. He doesn't have to be a big name, or a legendary player. He just has to be able to get a team playing properly. They've had Keegan, Dalglish, Gullitt, Robson and now Souness, possibly Shearer next, all on name value. They should sack Souness, and get Paul Le Guen in before some other top side snaps him up.
How is he a joke more like?

And apparently, Le Guen is heading to Italy.
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Old 06-15-2005, 01:43 PM   #5605
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He is a joke because he has never won anything of note, apart from one FA Cup, in management outside of Scotland. He took the great Liverpool team which dominated the English game for two decades and led it into a slump from which it still hasn't really recovered with the same disregard for tactics/organisation and largely idiotic transfer decisions he has shown throughout his time as a manager.

He continually has public feuds with talented players, to show what a hard man he is rather than keep things private and sort them out professionally.
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Old 06-15-2005, 01:54 PM   #5606
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Yeah I agree with ECG, Souness is a cunt.
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Old 06-15-2005, 01:56 PM   #5607
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yianni
lol @ you cunts not even caring

Cmon Wengerland, fire up son, Zagorakis is in Greece's team!
I'll be watching most of it, don't you worry about that mate First live match is Brazil against Greece anyway, which should be awesome

Bit surprised Theo's in the squad actually, Bologna have got a relegation play-off this weekend, so i thought he'd be needed there. I don't know if it was a wind-up, probably was but oh well, but Sky are meant to be doing a '50 Greatest goals vs Man Utd' programme, and Theo's against them seems to be getting the concensus of Leicester fans' votes Shame it was in a 6-2 defeat
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Old 06-15-2005, 01:58 PM   #5608
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Originally Posted by Wengerland

Have Birmingham signed Nafti permanently aswell?

We signed him a couple of weeks ago. I am a little concerned we seem to be going over board on midfielders. we have dunn, izzet, nafti, clemence, carter and if we sign bowyer thats six players alone who play in the center of midfield.
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Old 06-15-2005, 02:24 PM   #5609
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wengerland
I'll be watching most of it, don't you worry about that mate First live match is Brazil against Greece anyway, which should be awesome

Bit surprised Theo's in the squad actually, Bologna have got a relegation play-off this weekend, so i thought he'd be needed there. I don't know if it was a wind-up, probably was but oh well, but Sky are meant to be doing a '50 Greatest goals vs Man Utd' programme, and Theo's against them seems to be getting the concensus of Leicester fans' votes Shame it was in a 6-2 defeat
I know. Theo is the fucking man, so is King Otto. I was shattered when Greece copped the 0-1 against Ukraine in Athens last week, the lads dominated yet Ukraine got the result. I'd love to see Prince Theo represent Hellas in the World Cup before retiring, what an absolute legend!

And yeah, apparently Bolongna didn't need/want him there for their relegation play-off, looks like the geiser is either on his way out of there or/and has told them to fuck off cos he wants to represent his country first!
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Old 06-15-2005, 02:32 PM   #5610
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Quote:
Originally Posted by El Capitano Gatisto
How exactly is Graeme Souness not a joke?

Alan Shearer would be another joke appointment. Just get a good fucking coach and tactician. He doesn't have to be a big name, or a legendary player. He just has to be able to get a team playing properly. They've had Keegan, Dalglish, Gullitt, Robson and now Souness, possibly Shearer next, all on name value. They should sack Souness, and get Paul Le Guen in before some other top side snaps him up.
Disagree completely with Gullit, I know he was rubbish at Newcastle, but he was superb for us, him being a big name meant players like Zola, Vialli, Di Matteo (not sure actually if he was big) could come, and we won the F.A cup under him and he took us to the semi's of the League Cup and Cup Winners Cup before getting sacked. I think he was fairly well proven when Newcastle got him.
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Old 06-15-2005, 02:36 PM   #5611
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No he wasn't. He was another big name who'd done fuck all as a manager relying on reputation.
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Old 06-15-2005, 02:37 PM   #5612
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No, you are thinking of when Bates hired him for us. Newcastle had no reason not to go for him.
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Old 06-15-2005, 02:44 PM   #5613
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Him having done nothing in managerial terms would be good enough reason. An FA Cup and signing a bunch of overpaid foreigners coming to the end of their careers isn't a good track record. Chelsea were in such terrible fucking shape before Abramovich bailed them out because of a succession of regimes relying on signing highly-paid, formerly world class players who could turn it on now and then but who were never going to win a Premiership.

You argue for the sake of arguing: fact is, Gullitt had done little as a manager and never once showed he was capable of building a side which could perform consistently and sustain a level of performance. Newcastle need a coach who can do that. They haven't had one, even including Kevin Keegan, for as long as I have been watching football.

If you look at the top managers in the Premiership today, they are there because they get the best out of players, even average ones, and they build TEAMS. It's worth a gamble on a lower division or foreign manager who shows an aptitude for team building and tactical knowledge, rather than going for yet another big name living off a very old and tarnished reputation who will demand money and ultimately fail.

They were wrong to even give Bobby Robson so much time and money to play with. His club record wasn't that fantastic since leaving the England job. It's a little-mentioned fact that the PSV fans hated him.
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Old 06-15-2005, 02:49 PM   #5614
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If I remember rightly Gullit quit the Feyenoord job a couple weeks ago after they finished 3rd (I think it was 3rd anyway) after only being hired start of last season.

McNamara has signed on a free
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Old 06-15-2005, 03:00 PM   #5615
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How is it arguing for the sake of arguing? Up until Jose came I haven't seen us play as good football as under Gullit (note the one 't', not two), you clearly don't remember just how good the actual football played was. And he didn't just get aload of people at the end of their career Vialli was the only player who really did only have a couple of seasons left in him, Di MAtteo retired through injury, Zola (probablY) and Lebouef retired this summer, so they were far fromt he end of their career.

I admit that he hadn't done enough to manage a top team, but he showed that he has what it takes, we finished 6th, won a cup and it could have been three, in the short time he was there, (we were hardly swamped with old people in his side either, I think he'd have been able to build). How the fuck do you think that thats easy. One of my greatest memories of a Chelsea game was when we were 2-0 down to Liverpool at half time, and we ended up winning 4-2, granted Liverpool had Roy Evans in charge that day (I think) but we were playing against a better side then us and still won it.

Also, Vialli had no experience as a manager either, we took a gamble on him, I was never a fan but he did get us third in the league and we did beat Barcelona 3-1 in our own gaff, getting to the Champions League Quarter Final was hardly easy and he won us three real cups.
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Old 06-15-2005, 03:01 PM   #5616
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Quote:
Originally Posted by El Capitano Gatisto
Him having done nothing in managerial terms would be good enough reason. An FA Cup and signing a bunch of overpaid foreigners coming to the end of their careers isn't a good track record. Chelsea were in such terrible fucking shape before Abramovich bailed them out because of a succession of regimes relying on signing highly-paid, formerly world class players who could turn it on now and then but who were never going to win a Premiership.

You argue for the sake of arguing: fact is, Gullitt had done little as a manager and never once showed he was capable of building a side which could perform consistently and sustain a level of performance. Newcastle need a coach who can do that. They haven't had one, even including Kevin Keegan, for as long as I have been watching football.

If you look at the top managers in the Premiership today, they are there because they get the best out of players, even average ones, and they build TEAMS. It's worth a gamble on a lower division or foreign manager who shows an aptitude for team building and tactical knowledge, rather than going for yet another big name living off a very old and tarnished reputation who will demand money and ultimately fail.

They were wrong to even give Bobby Robson so much time and money to play with. His club record wasn't that fantastic since leaving the England job. It's a little-mentioned fact that the PSV fans hated him.
Look I'm a dumb cunt (compared to you blokes anyway) when it comes to English football but even I have to agree with what ECG says, although admittedly I cannot comment much on the comments he makes about Bobby Robson as ultimately I don't know how PSV fans rated the bloke.
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Old 06-15-2005, 03:03 PM   #5617
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Robert just signed a 3 year deal with us. Shove that up your arse Alladyce you obese sourfaced old cunt.

Are we Newcastle circa 2002 in disguise?
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Old 06-15-2005, 03:07 PM   #5618
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Ahahahaha Alladyce might be a fat cunt but the cunt had achieved more than you cunts

Ok I admit I'm deliberately supporting managers of successul Greek national team players . Out of interest, is Chalkias still at Pompey? I still prefer Nikopolidis but we need replacement cunts and Chalkias isn't too bad !
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Old 06-15-2005, 03:09 PM   #5619
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yianni
Look I'm a dumb cunt (compared to you blokes anyway) when it comes to English football but even I have to agree with what ECG says, although admittedly I cannot comment much on the comments he makes about Bobby Robson as ultimately I don't know how PSV fans rated the bloke.
I agree with most of it, just Ruud Gullit was great for us and I won't hear of him bashing him
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Old 06-15-2005, 03:09 PM   #5620
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whiney faggot #1
How is it arguing for the sake of arguing? Up until Jose came I haven't seen us play as good football as under Gullit (note the one 't', not two), you clearly don't remember just how good the actual football played was. And he didn't just get aload of people at the end of their career Vialli was the only player who really did only have a couple of seasons left in him, Di MAtteo retired through injury, Zola (probablY) and Lebouef retired this summer, so they were far fromt he end of their career.

I admit that he hadn't done enough to manage a top team, but he showed that he has what it takes, we finished 6th, won a cup and it could have been three, in the short time he was there, (we were hardly swamped with old people in his side either, I think he'd have been able to build). How the fuck do you think that thats easy. One of my greatest memories of a Chelsea game was when we were 2-0 down to Liverpool at half time, and we ended up winning 4-2, granted Liverpool had Roy Evans in charge that day (I think) but we were playing against a better side then us and still won it.

Also, Vialli had no experience as a manager either, we took a gamble on him, I was never a fan but he did get us third in the league and we did beat Barcelona 3-1 in our own gaff, getting to the Champions League Quarter Final was hardly easy and he won us three real cups.
I am saying that none of this is a good managerial record. If you look at the top 4 or 5 managers in the Premiership today (Ferguson, Wenger, Mourinho, Moyes Benitez), they are all men who had average or unremarkable careers as players. In the case of Mourinho, almost no career as a player.

They have all come from solid backgrounds as talented coaches or background staff, and people who have achieved impressive results with smaller teams, not on the back of a huge reputation as a star player.

I don't care about the football Chelsea played. They had top players, playing for a team who weren't really going anywhere.

My original point, absolutely lost in the mix, as usual with you, is that Newcastle, and all clubs, should be looking for managers with real credentials and the proven ability to create good teams. Of course, sometimes a big name manager can be good at that off the bat, like Mark Hughes appears to be, but Newcastle have had a succession of managers who've made extremely poor decisions in the transfer market and have not managed to build a consistent, spirited team.

Gullitt was never the man to do that, his time at Chelsea, subsequently at Newcastle, and his current record, all show that.
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Old 06-15-2005, 03:12 PM   #5621
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yeah he is but he got dropped, he made a couple of mistakes and a lot of people got on his back, he earned the nick name "Chalky the Clown" after about 3 matches. I always loved him though, he seems hilarious. We got rid of Shaka so he is our most experienced keeper now.

-edit-

While we're on the subject of Greeks, I kept meaning to ask you; is Giannis Skopelitis (the other Greek player we signed with Chalky) a Greek international? Media people often refer to him as an international but I didn't see him in the Euro 2004 squad.
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Old 06-15-2005, 03:17 PM   #5622
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I know he stunk up the place on Tyneside, but I can also see why they chose him, he had been quality at us, he looked like he could be great and I think it was worth it.

Also, seeing as how Didier Deschamps got into the Champions League final last season and Frank Rijkaard just won La Liga I think it shows that you just pick on a few managers who are doing good yet didn't have great playing careers. Newcastle had every right to take a chance on Gullit.

Also, if you could ask Jose Mourinho who taught him EVERYTHING he learnt about being a manager, guess who he'd say, Bobby fucking Robson. Mourinho has combined what Robson taught him and his own genius qualities to become a top manager. Therefore, I can see why Newcastle got Sir Bobby too.
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Old 06-15-2005, 03:37 PM   #5623
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Ban Fan
yeah he is but he got dropped, he made a couple of mistakes and a lot of people got on his back, he earned the nick name "Chalky the Clown" after about 3 matches. I always loved him though, he seems hilarious. We got rid of Shaka so he is our most experienced keeper now.
Admittedly I haven't watched much of the English Premiership however when I've seen him play he's done quite well for Pompey. I believe he used to play for Panathinaikos before he moved to England?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Ban Fan
While we're on the subject of Greeks, I kept meaning to ask you; is Giannis Skopelitis (the other Greek player we signed with Chalky) a Greek international? Media people often refer to him as an international but I didn't see him in the Euro 2004 squad.
Not to my knowledge. I hate saying this, but you guys cannot understand how limited football coverage is here in Australia. I'd love nothing more than to go and live in either England or Greece and inform those interested lads of the happenings of Greek football but alas I can't, I'm too attracted to Australia even though it has fuck all coverage of the world game.

However RBF, if I was to take a guess, I'd guess it's a 99% chance King Otto did not include him in the Euro 2004 squad.
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Old 06-15-2005, 03:39 PM   #5624
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Mourinho probably learned equally as much from Louis van Gaal Dazz, he was only a translator for Robson he was assistant for van Gaal.

BTW didn't Benitez play for Real Madrid? Not exactly an average career

-edit- My bad, he coached the youth team

And I'd argue Mark Hughes being a good manager ECG. Before he left the Wales job they went about a year without winning, and Blackburn stayed up by kicking the shit out of people and Brad Friedel performing the occasional miracle. I'll reserve judgement on him til the end of this coming season, if he gets rid of players like Emerton (which has been rumoured) Blackburn could really struggle.
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Old 06-15-2005, 03:42 PM   #5625
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Emerton is shit.

Mark Hughes turned Blackburn from a team with a laughable defence to one of the meanest in the Premiership, with basically the same personnel as Souness had. That goes to show that tactics and organisation have a large say aside from the players you put in there. It had a lot more to it than simply Brad Friedal.

He unearthed a couple of gems in Mokoena and Nelsen. Nelsen is a class player. I think Hughes has done as all good managers do first and foremost: made his team hard to beat, stopped them sliding. The problem is the squad Souness left him with is bereft of attacking talent, so he has to remedy that. Look at his options up front, there isn't much there to work with.
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Old 06-15-2005, 03:47 PM   #5626
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I agree that Emerton is shit. He plays right-mid for Australia and whilst the cunt makes good runs forward he can't cross for fucking shit. Look out for Ahmed Elrich, a new signing for Fulham, who from what I've seen (both in the national league in Australia and internationally with the national team) is a great player. Hope I'm not proven wrong!
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Old 06-15-2005, 03:51 PM   #5627
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Jose says that he learnt from Bobby Robson, I might look in his autobiography later and check what he says about Van Gaal, but he gives Robson a shitload of credit.

Also, Freidal wasn't nearly as good as he normally is this season.
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Old 06-15-2005, 04:07 PM   #5628
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You bought his autobiography
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Old 06-15-2005, 04:17 PM   #5629
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Whose, Robson's or Freidal's
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Old 06-15-2005, 04:31 PM   #5630
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Mourinho I'm guessing.
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Old 06-15-2005, 05:10 PM   #5631
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Fuck I'm a drunk idiot, I didn't look at Dazz's post properly.
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Old 06-15-2005, 09:09 PM   #5632
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Monday Morning
You bought his autobiography
My brother did, I would have otherwise.

Don't look at me like that

I also have a Ruud Gullit biography and auto biography, a Dennis Wise one, a Zola one, a 96/97 season (Gullit's first year in charge) and a 2003 one.

If I am gunna read any book, it's a Chelsea one.
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Old 06-16-2005, 07:26 AM   #5633
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Ok just thought I'd wade into the Newcastle manager debate.

Firstly Souness: I'm still not a fan at all to be honest. His man management leaves a lot to be desired as does his team selection. His transfer policy in general hasn't been to bad and this season if we do indeed sign Parker then that will be a good coup. Defence is an issue as is another striker so we'll see how we do with that. My main gripe with him is basically what ECG has hinted at. That he can't make Newcastle defend even simple situations. Most of our goals conceded are what pundits would call "silly goals". Easily avoidable and mainly due to either shocking individual errors or just general incompetence (failure to clear a simple ball, terrible offside traps etc). You don't need genius defenders for the majority of defensive work - it helps but simple organisation gets you most of the way eg Greece 2004.

Robson I was a great fan of. His transfer policy was more chequered (Carl Cort anyone?) but generally not too shabby. Bellamy and Jenas in particular were good buys. I would prefer him over Souness any day and feel with him around we would have done better last season no doubt. He was a managerial legend no matter what anyone says and a great man who was well respected. The selling of Solano was his downfall a fantastic player, who loved the club and a fan favourite who was shunned frequently and sold for fuck all.

Gullit was a joke. I can see where Dazz was coming from in that I thought he did ok at Chelsea. The buying of Dyer was an inspired one (though Dyer hasn't lived up to his full potential). Otherwise the team was bereft of invention and very poor.

As for Shearer as next manager well to me that has disaster written all over it. He's a local legend but going in to Newcastle as your first job is going to be terrible. The Geordies will turn on even Shearer if things aren't going well and will expect some sort of fairytale recovery under him. He could throw away his legendary status if it goes wrong and I think it will.
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Old 06-16-2005, 07:34 AM   #5634
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Cort is the man
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Old 06-16-2005, 12:33 PM   #5635
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Parker to Newcastle for £6.5m, confirmed
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Old 06-16-2005, 12:56 PM   #5636
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Old 06-16-2005, 01:13 PM   #5637
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Quote:
Originally Posted by packt up
Ok just thought I'd wade into the Newcastle manager debate.

Firstly Souness: I'm still not a fan at all to be honest. His man management leaves a lot to be desired as does his team selection. His transfer policy in general hasn't been to bad and this season if we do indeed sign Parker then that will be a good coup. Defence is an issue as is another striker so we'll see how we do with that. My main gripe with him is basically what ECG has hinted at. That he can't make Newcastle defend even simple situations. Most of our goals conceded are what pundits would call "silly goals". Easily avoidable and mainly due to either shocking individual errors or just general incompetence (failure to clear a simple ball, terrible offside traps etc). You don't need genius defenders for the majority of defensive work - it helps but simple organisation gets you most of the way eg Greece 2004.

Robson I was a great fan of. His transfer policy was more chequered (Carl Cort anyone?) but generally not too shabby. Bellamy and Jenas in particular were good buys. I would prefer him over Souness any day and feel with him around we would have done better last season no doubt. He was a managerial legend no matter what anyone says and a great man who was well respected. The selling of Solano was his downfall a fantastic player, who loved the club and a fan favourite who was shunned frequently and sold for fuck all.

Gullit was a joke. I can see where Dazz was coming from in that I thought he did ok at Chelsea. The buying of Dyer was an inspired one (though Dyer hasn't lived up to his full potential). Otherwise the team was bereft of invention and very poor.

As for Shearer as next manager well to me that has disaster written all over it. He's a local legend but going in to Newcastle as your first job is going to be terrible. The Geordies will turn on even Shearer if things aren't going well and will expect some sort of fairytale recovery under him. He could throw away his legendary status if it goes wrong and I think it will.
Pretty much agree with everything you said there, I am a bit wary of Shearer taking over at Newcastle as his first job, it would be so awesome if he was really successful but on the flipside it would be a disaster if he was a load of crap.

I forgot we even had Carl Cort, and I miss Solano
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Old 06-16-2005, 01:48 PM   #5638
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Greece Brazil tomorrow
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Old 06-16-2005, 02:26 PM   #5639
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I thought the season was over
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Old 06-16-2005, 03:22 PM   #5640
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Quote:
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Ahahahaha Alladyce might be a fat cunt but the cunt had achieved more than you cunts
LOL

The word 'cunt' so many times made me crease up

Ferret, the season has finished but now we get the end of season national teams' competitions. The main ones are every 4 years but not many people are bothered about the one starting today as most teams field weakened sides. On paper it should be second to the World Cup, with the champions from each continent, but it's just not really (unless Greece win it).
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