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Old 04-25-2022, 05:53 PM   #3681
#1-norm-fan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xrodmuc316 View Post
2020 and 2022 are different times
If only you weren’t the same Cumdorx
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Old 04-25-2022, 06:00 PM   #3682
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I'm available to edit/produce this rasslin podcast.
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Old 04-25-2022, 06:01 PM   #3683
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Glorious dragging by fan
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Old 04-25-2022, 06:03 PM   #3684
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Quote:
Originally Posted by #1-norm-fan View Post
You probably should have steered clear of the entire conversation we were having about fake “ignoring” and the “view post” option because every time you try to throw in your two cents on that subject I’m gonna bring it up no matter how uncomfortable it makes you.
What I said in 2020 and what I said in 2022 are separate instances. Just because I said I had you on ignore and still read your posts in 2020 does not mean I said I had you on ignore in 2022. You realize the concept of different situations right?

The only thing uncomfortable is your Weird Obsessive behaviour.
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Old 04-25-2022, 06:09 PM   #3685
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You realize I have indisputable evidence of you lying about ignoring me once so your claim that you didn’t mean you were ACTUALLY ignoring me this time after you suddenly referenced a post of mine doesn’t hold much weight, right? Because you’re a proven liar in this exact situation.

Last time you were just smart enough to delete the post hopefully before anyone saw it. You’ve regressed mentally. It makes sense that you weren’t quick enough this time.
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Old 04-25-2022, 06:11 PM   #3686
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Quote:
Originally Posted by #1-norm-fan View Post
You realize I have indisputable evidence of you lying about ignoring me once so your claim that you didn’t mean you were ACTUALLY ignoring me this time after you suddenly referenced a post of mine doesn’t hold much weight, right? Because you’re a proven liar in this exact situation.

Last time you were just smart enough to delete the post hopefully before anyone saw it.
2020 bro, it is 2022 now
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Old 04-25-2022, 06:12 PM   #3687
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We finished watching the second season of that Ruthless Aggression show. Really enjoyed it. Finlay sneaking actual moves into women's matches was great.
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Old 04-25-2022, 06:13 PM   #3688
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Again, I’d give benefit of the doubt if you’d shown some growth since then but you haven’t. So no. Your desperate pleas for your lying shithead ways to be left in the past are denied. Again, be better.
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Old 04-25-2022, 06:15 PM   #3689
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It also made me want to watch Tough Enough again. I remember most of the first two seasons but not much after that of the original run.

Always thought it was fucked how these new rasslers were openly shat on by everyone (via commentary teams making fun of them). Sure they weren't great, but they were pretty brand new to the game. I imagine you don't develop the timing and whatnot overnight, no matter how strong or athletic you are.
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Old 04-25-2022, 06:20 PM   #3690
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Quote:
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It also made me want to watch Tough Enough again. I remember most of the first two seasons but not much after that of the original run.
There’s definitely a reason for that. I’ve gone back and watched the first Tough Enough and enjoyed it for nostalgia only. It was great because it was different but looking back now it’s kind of awful in concept and execution.
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Old 04-25-2022, 06:20 PM   #3691
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I remember being a huge Maven fan coming out of it. Seems ridiculous now.
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Old 04-25-2022, 06:22 PM   #3692
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Quote:
Originally Posted by #1-norm-fan View Post
I remember being a huge Maven fan coming out of it. Seems ridiculous now.
lol maven showed up in a GCW battle royal over WM weekend, dropkicked like 10 people, then just left the match eliminating himself. perfect.
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Old 04-25-2022, 06:25 PM   #3693
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xrodmuc316 View Post
What I said in 2020 and what I said in 2022 are separate instances. Just because I said I had you on ignore and still read your posts in 2020 does not mean I said I had you on ignore in 2022. You realize the concept of different situations right?

The only thing uncomfortable is your Weird Obsessive behaviour.
Dude, you can have him on ignore and not read his posts. You can have him on ignore and hit view post for context at times. You can not have him on ignore and still ignore him. It doesn’t fucking matter. He is a fixated clown. None of it matters, all of it is stupid. There is no point in trying to reason with it. It is not honest.
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Old 04-25-2022, 06:26 PM   #3694
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This thread is about to be about how how AEW is and how cold WWE is. 518k to 1.95 mil, baby. Watcha got for the A-side next week?
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Old 04-25-2022, 06:31 PM   #3695
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Nerfect View Post
It is not honest.
…

Quote:
Originally Posted by xrodmuc316 View Post
This dude knows I don't read his posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by xrodmuc316 View Post
Yes, I do click "View Post" to see what you have wrote most of the time.
…

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Nerfect View Post
* Cody vs. MJF. If I recall, this was badly explained on TV. The Cody/Max relationship was brought up a couple of times, then MJF just randomly turned heel on Cody and they never touched again.
(Incoming…)
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Old 04-25-2022, 08:17 PM   #3696
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honest query: has AEW hit a mild plateau and if so whats the next step?
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Old 04-25-2022, 08:31 PM   #3697
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i think they have definitely plateaued. i think one thing they need to focus on more is appealing to people who come in clueless. so much of their stuff is predicated on knowledge of people/things from outside of their company or is YouTube only content. that is MAYBE a quarter of their TV audience, and it's just not smart. my sister legit started watching wrestling for the first time when AEW started, and i constantly have to field questions for her that TV should be answering. she can't be alone in that, and not everyone has the resources and/or patience to fill themselves in. and they shouldn't have to.
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Old 04-25-2022, 08:49 PM   #3698
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ok maybe i don't CONSTANTLY take questions but you catch my drift
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Old 04-25-2022, 09:43 PM   #3699
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We only watch dynamite and rampage every week and still feel like we're not "in" on everything because we don't know who some of these surprise debuts are (Jay White being the big one in mind rn).

We can barely keep up with those two (+ whatever WWE we catch) so there's no way we're going to stay up on dark, elevation, & bte. Feel like the main shows should be filling in a lot more gaps.
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Old 04-25-2022, 09:44 PM   #3700
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(I get that the company wants us to watch all of their shows, as they should. But there's no way they can expect everyone to be able to do that + know about these people coming from new Japan or wherever)
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Old 04-25-2022, 09:47 PM   #3701
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All that to say rtd is right and AEW should be letting us know what's what without expecting us to watch 5 shows a week
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Old 04-25-2022, 09:49 PM   #3702
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Quote:
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I remember being a huge Maven fan coming out of it. Seems ridiculous now.
We went to a RAW or something in like 2012 and I started a "we want Maven" chant outside that got some traction. Was fun.

Shane Douglas also walked right behind me in the crowd during that show.
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Old 04-25-2022, 09:52 PM   #3703
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They’re definitely bad at explaining every thread (and following them through). I think the presentation of the promotion and it having such an indy feel means it’s going to have an indy appeal. Those kind of fans are not going to carry you further. It’s a disservice to make wrestling so arcane.

It’s who they choose to feature, how they feature them and how they explain that.
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Old 04-25-2022, 11:11 PM   #3704
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@ron/schreech/noid



so is this oversaturation or is it simply poor communication? is likely both but which is the chief offender?
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Old 04-25-2022, 11:15 PM   #3705
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I can’t pick one over the other. I think it’s oversaturation. I think having Rampage and all these other shows hurts more than helps. But there’s no good excuse for the communication side of things.

But I don’t like the what of their stories most of the time either. They just don’t do it for me.
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Old 04-25-2022, 11:19 PM   #3706
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both certainly play their part but i'd place it more in the poor communication camp. it's not like they do a great job of hyping their YouTube stuff on TV as far as i can tell. there may be a reason for that? i dunno but i have watched dozens of decent to solid promos for guys they are trying to build disappear into the internet abyss and never see the light of TV.
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Old 04-25-2022, 11:21 PM   #3707
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Nerfect View Post
I can’t pick one over the other. I think it’s oversaturation. I think having Rampage and all these other shows hurts more than helps. But there’s no good excuse for the communication side of things.

But I don’t like the what of their stories most of the time either. They just don’t do it for me.
i feel like they have the depth and talent to fill the time they have if utilized properly. but time is beginning to show TK is still booking for his fantasy feds and that's only going to take you so far.
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Old 04-25-2022, 11:32 PM   #3708
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Originally Posted by ron the dial View Post
i feel like they have the depth and talent to fill the time they have if utilized properly. but time is beginning to show TK is still booking for his fantasy feds and that's only going to take you so far.
Good thought.

I personally don’t know about the talent. There are obviously some good guys there. But a lot of the people considered good, by the fans and the company, are just generic indy style bums to me. The older I get, the more off-putting I find people marking out for a guy who kicked out of a finisher like it’s any big deal.

The modern style is just not going to work for me. But I think they could choose different people to take the spots and fill two hours way better. And agree with your thoughts on booking.
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Old 04-26-2022, 12:21 AM   #3709
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I think they need to reformat their show and make the champ the main focus. I like a lot of what they do but not having your top champion be the focal point of the show is hurting his run.
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Old 04-26-2022, 08:52 AM   #3710
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Definitely communications.


Youtube could be invaluable to them, as it is easier accessible than their weekly cable shows. They could post a swath of info there and/or link it to their site to "fill people in". That definitely has early millennium vibes like the top 8 of MySpace..... but it could help in terms of "who TF is this new vanilla midget?"


They badly need someone with "expertise" in the booking area. There's definitely been a big pattern to weekly TV that is easily noticeable, and has become as predictable as other wrestling products. RTD is right, they have the talent and roster depth...... now let's make it make sense.


Still, easily the best wrestling show to watch on TV. I sincerely cannot wait until WWE fucks off with their shaky cam shit.
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Old 04-26-2022, 10:12 AM   #3711
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Nerfect View Post
Good thought.

I personally don’t know about the talent. There are obviously some good guys there. But a lot of the people considered good, by the fans and the company, are just generic indy style bums to me. The older I get, the more off-putting I find people marking out for a guy who kicked out of a finisher like it’s any big deal.

The modern style is just not going to work for me. But I think they could choose different people to take the spots and fill two hours way better. And agree with your thoughts on booking.
You know I totally agree. The modern style of wrestling is "better" in some ways, imagine if you were the kid version of you and were able to see a 2022 Dynamite match after watching years of WWF Superstars. You'd be blown the fuck away. But yeah we get that every single week, match after match in both WWE and AEW and anywhere else.

I call it Hyper Speed wrestling. I feel like it really got to this level with Ricochet and Ospreay had that Super Juniors match that pissed Vader off so bad. Since then NJPW went to hyper speed for almost every big match, then ROH copied and PWG took it to a whole new level. It seeped into NXT and took over and of course worked it's way to the main roster by default.

You can't change it at this point it just won't go back. For me I can still enjoy Hyper Speed wrestling but it does match a two hour show a bit up and down for me. However generally speaking AEW PPV's which are all on hyper speed are fucking awesome. I think at least they are only doing 4 a year so it really feels like "something special" to have a 4 hour wrestlefuck fest on speed.
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Old 04-26-2022, 10:19 AM   #3712
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You definitely can slow it down and be fine. CM Punk proves that with every one of his matches. A lot of the guys just kind of suck and don't get the point.
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Old 04-26-2022, 10:26 AM   #3713
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Here's a simple way to break it down:


Old school: Tell a story and get a reaction by selling


New school: Get pops by flipping and kicking out of finishers
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Old 04-26-2022, 10:40 AM   #3714
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the guys on top, who actually sell the tickets, always slow their shit down. when you're training kids half of your time is spent repeating "its not a race"
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Old 04-26-2022, 10:58 AM   #3715
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I recall being told once....




"It's been 2 minutes, you've ran through 3 sequences. Why? Don't blow yourself up so quick...." and some other stuff.
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Old 04-26-2022, 11:00 AM   #3716
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I am not an avid consumer of their work, but it’s why whenever I do catch some New Japan, Okada and Tanahashi stand out to me. They find time to breathe. I’m just not impressed by a guy running into a corner, jumping over the top rope and springing off with a moonsault without even checking to see where his opponent is.

It makes such a difference. And I could hear the argument that it makes top guys stand out, but I think it runs people off, because the undercard of things can just be so counterintuitive to what people expect from conflict. Gives everyone who might be inclined to say “You like that fake shit?!” a reason to laugh at it and walk away instead of becoming invested like they once might have been

The work doesn’t take enough blame for running off people.
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Old 04-26-2022, 11:01 AM   #3717
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drave View Post
Here's a simple way to break it down:


Old school: Tell a story and get a reaction by selling


New school: Get pops by flipping and kicking out of finishers


More and more I find myself annoyed at people who still go for the flipping like they haven’t seen it a million times before now though. It’s fucking boring lol.
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Old 04-26-2022, 11:07 AM   #3718
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Quote:
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You know I totally agree. The modern style of wrestling is "better" in some ways, imagine if you were the kid version of you and were able to see a 2022 Dynamite match after watching years of WWF Superstars. You'd be blown the fuck away. But yeah we get that every single week, match after match in both WWE and AEW and anywhere else.

I call it Hyper Speed wrestling. I feel like it really got to this level with Ricochet and Ospreay had that Super Juniors match that pissed Vader off so bad. Since then NJPW went to hyper speed for almost every big match, then ROH copied and PWG took it to a whole new level. It seeped into NXT and took over and of course worked it's way to the main roster by default.

You can't change it at this point it just won't go back. For me I can still enjoy Hyper Speed wrestling but it does match a two hour show a bit up and down for me. However generally speaking AEW PPV's which are all on hyper speed are fucking awesome. I think at least they are only doing 4 a year so it really feels like "something special" to have a 4 hour wrestlefuck fest on speed.
I respect what you’re saying here. I don’t really agree with the AEW PPV point and feel it started to boil over before even Ospreay/Ricochet and has got a whole bunch of different sources, but I get what you’re saying here.

For the record, I think BOSJ ‘95, ECW, The Radicalz, casual fans getting run off, Triple H, ROH, CM Punk, Bryan Danielson and Meltzer have all contributed to the circumstances that make this shit en vogue with such a loud and vocal segment of the audience.

Overall, I think that since kayfabe was put on life support and no one tries to keep it up, there’s been a shift from reacting to the action to reacting to a perceived quality of the performance. There are guys that “deserve” main event runs (the story of Benoit and Eddie’s rise), and guys who “don’t” (a large part of Cena rejection).
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Old 04-26-2022, 11:51 AM   #3719
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Yes the origins of the "hyper speed" style can be debated and do go back even to Tiger Mask/Dynamite Kid. Regardless of the origins it dominates now. I was really hoping that AEW's "sports presentation" that was mentioned early from Cody (before the TV deal), would bring with it that sense of "kayfabe".

It's almost like AEW has replaced kayfabe with "smarkness". Like to know the internet culture, Meltzer's taste etc... that's who the company caters too and even so much that it's nearly acknowledged on a constant basis.

There is a lot of talent available to do something "else". Freddy Prince Jr still making statements about starting his company. I'd like a show that keeps it simple, kayfabed, with high production values. Slow it down, totally try and teach the audience what wrestling is. Tell us why there are no closed fist punches, use that as a heel maneuver, explain why wrestlers do irish whips and how that isn't a technique used in any other combat sport... make the fakeness and bullshitness of pro wrestling make sense through kayfabe.

This is actually where Tony Schiavonie shines on color, he can make the dumbest shit work in a fayfabe sense. At least enough to suspend your disbelief.

I feel like there is a way using kayfabe to enhance simplistic wrestling so that we don't have constant spot fests and so many tiny guys flip flopping around.

I like to see a company come along that can become financially successful without feeling the need to take over the world. Just be a successful company with a strong fan base. If a TV deal is pressuring you constantly to be as big as WWE, then don't take that deal. There are plenty of ways to get a show over it doesn't have to be on cable TV anymore.
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Old 04-26-2022, 12:18 PM   #3720
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I dont mind Rampage, but it is not really needed. Other than the Live Editions I don't usually care to watch.

The Youtube shows though are required viewing in AEW's universe. They stick somebody on their for 3 months with no TV exposure, then suddenly expect their entire audience to know why suddenly that person is ranked high and in title contention.

Scorpio Sky was undefeated in singles competition for over a year, and nobody knew until they mentioned it on TV during his quick build to the TNT Title, but at least he is somebody known with credibility.

For most fans, Dark and Dark Elevation might as well be house shows and should not factor into storylines, and certainly not positioned as something AEW should assume fans watch.
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