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Old 06-04-2013, 08:19 PM   #1361
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According to ESPN's Outside the Line report, MLB is ready to suspend A-Rod, Braun, and anyone else who's names showed up on the Miami clinic list. They finally were supplied with enough proof/evidence that any appeal would likely be rejected or a waste of time.

The official outing of players is expected to occur next week and suspensions the following week.

Quote:
Major League Baseball will seek to suspend about 20 players connected to the Miami-area clinic at the heart of an ongoing performance-enhancing drug scandal, including Alex Rodriguez and Ryan Braun, possibly within the next few weeks, "Outside the Lines" has learned. If the suspensions are upheld, the performance-enhancing drug scandal would be the largest in American sports history.

Tony Bosch, founder of the now-shuttered Biogenesis of America, reached an agreement this week to cooperate with MLB's investigation, two sources told "Outside the Lines," giving MLB the ammunition officials believe they need to suspend the players.

One source familiar with the case said the commissioner's office might seek 100-game suspensions for Rodriguez, Braun and other players, the penalty for a second doping offense. The argument, the source said, is the players' connection to Bosch constitutes one offense, and previous statements to MLB officials denying any such connection or the use of PEDs constitute another.
http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_/...-investigation
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Old 06-04-2013, 08:25 PM   #1362
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Fuck me, Everth Cabrera and Yasmani Grandal are both on that list. Cabrera has been a huge contributor this year. Losing him as starting shortstop for 50 games would be devastating. There's no one in the system to come up and replace his production, either.

Grandal already served his 50 games, so I don't see why he'd get another suspension.

I hope to holy hell Braun gets suspended. That fucker was guilty and he should have served his suspension the first time.
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Old 06-04-2013, 08:25 PM   #1363
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Watching the Pirates/Braves game and they mentioned Braun and A-Rod. Interested to hear who the other 18-20 are. They said it best during the broadcast: In this day and age and knowing all that players know after seeing all the other men fall from grace....why??? and just how stupid can you be?
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Old 06-04-2013, 08:28 PM   #1364
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Oh I saw the list.....Only ray of light is that Gio only got "legal" drugs.....He's one of my favorite guys right now.
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Old 06-04-2013, 08:28 PM   #1365
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Not sure if everyone would get 50 games. Isn't that for failing the league substance drug test? Technically they didn't fail a drug test.
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Old 06-04-2013, 08:29 PM   #1366
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Originally Posted by Damian Rey View Post
So because he's durable, he should make the all star game, despite being abysmal at the plate? Yeah...

WAR is great, but it's, as Brian Kenny states, an approximation, not a be all end all. Hardy's WAR is where it's at because he's playing a position that is thin on talent league wide and he's slugging over 400, at the moment. If you put Miguel Cabrera back at first base, or keep Trout in left field, their WAR will likely dip because it's easier to find first baseman (Fielder, Votto) and left fielders (Braun, Upton) who put up similar numbers to those two in otherwise historic type seasons. Nice try, though.

Hardy's an automatic out. He doesn't get on base. Because he doesn't get on base, he doesn't give his team a chance to score runs, and because he doesn't give his team a chance to score runs, he's not a particularly good player. His batting average, and more importantly, OBP, is below league average. His OPS is below league average. And, at 30 years old, he's slugging 30 points over his career number, which is league average over the course of his career. You expect a guy who can't spell the word "walk" to continue blindly running into homeruns? I don't, because, logically, it doesn't make any sense.

But then again, your touting a guy who's a below league average player as a leading all star candidate, so making sense must not be your specialty.

Speaking of Downtown Domonic Brown, where the fuck is screech so I can yell "I TOLD YOU SO" at him after a mini convo we had last year where I backed Brown. WHERE YOU AT, SCREECH!!!!
Yeah, jj not getting on base is totally killing the orioles offense which as it stands now is ranked 1st or 2nd in every offensive category. 12 homers and 30+ rbi for a guy that's been hitting in the 6 or 7 hole most of the season is terrible..he had 30 homers for the O's in 2011 in 129 games...
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Old 06-04-2013, 08:31 PM   #1367
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Because there's immense amounts of money involved. Melk Man got a two year, $18 million deal out of it. If you knew taking a substance would not only make you better at you're job, but would offer financial opportunity and security that could potentially set you up for life, and maybe your family, would you not at least contemplate it?

I know I would. Not to mention, look at all the weight loss supplements that are out there for general consumption. Fat burners, muscle builders, testosterone boosters, workout powders for endurance. We're always trying to put something in our bodies to get that extra step. Pro athletes are no different, they're just dealing with incredibly high stakes.
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Old 06-04-2013, 08:31 PM   #1368
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Pedro Alvarez of the Pirates = He gets a LOT of shit and a lot of heat from the Pirates fans. He's batting 188 to 199 BUT the dude leads the team with homers and comes in there and steps up and hits in the power spot that is sorely lacking otherwise.....Fans are dumb.
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Old 06-04-2013, 08:33 PM   #1369
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He hit a homer as soon as I finished typing that.
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Old 06-04-2013, 08:36 PM   #1370
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple Naitch View Post
Not sure if everyone would get 50 games. Isn't that for failing the league substance drug test? Technically they didn't fail a drug test.
Sounds like MLB is going for a hybrid punishment to ensure everyone gets hit with something. 50 games for the roid penalty (regardless of 1st or 2nd strike) and another 50 for lying.

Someone could pull a "Braun" and weasel out of the roid punishment but still be hit with the lying punishment.
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Old 06-04-2013, 08:37 PM   #1371
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El Toro is one dimensional but he is the dimension they need most offensively
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Old 06-04-2013, 08:38 PM   #1372
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The astros stadium is depressing me..
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Old 06-04-2013, 08:40 PM   #1373
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The astros stadium is depressing me..
sure it's not the team?
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Old 06-04-2013, 08:43 PM   #1374
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No..its too quiet..
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Old 06-04-2013, 08:45 PM   #1375
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Best crowd I have heard all year is the fans in Baltimore. Ole Ole chants and tons of interaction....I want to see a game there some day.


Pirates crowds blow as well. Beautiful stadium but it's filled with douchebags and crickets.
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Old 06-04-2013, 08:47 PM   #1376
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Quote:
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Yeah, jj not getting on base is totally killing the orioles offense which as it stands now is ranked 1st or 2nd in every offensive category. 12 homers and 30+ rbi for a guy that's been hitting in the 6 or 7 hole most of the season is terrible..
Way to use what his team is doing as a collective as an argument for him. You're talking about the all star game, where individuals who are at the top of the game at their positions are showcased. Hardy is no where near the best shortstop in the American League. Whatever the Orioles are doing as a unit has zero to do with his case as an all star.

Nor, outside of his homeruns, does he have anything to do with scoring runs because he's not creating situations for them to do that. Throw that RBI shit out of here. McClouth, Machado, Jones, Markakis and Davis have been excellent at getting on base. Any asshole with as many opportunities as Hardy regularly gets could drive in that many runs hitting 6th and 7th. He's hitting 240/308/379 with RISP. He's tallied the RBI because of number of opportunities, not because he's any good.

Getting on base is important. When you get on base, you don't make outs. Outs are bad. Hits and walks are good. How you cannot process that and put it together that Hardy making lots, and lots, and lots of outs does not constitute him being a good player, let alone an all star, is beyond me.

McClouth has been good. Jones, Davis and Machado have been good. Go toot your homer horn for them, because they deserve it. JJ Hardy does not. He's one of their two weakest regulars, i.e., one of their worst starting players. How is that an all star again?
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Old 06-04-2013, 08:49 PM   #1377
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I enjoyed him as a Brewer. Not so much as a Oriel at the moment.
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Old 06-04-2013, 08:49 PM   #1378
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Pedro Alvarez of the Pirates = He gets a LOT of shit and a lot of heat from the Pirates fans. He's batting 188 to 199 BUT the dude leads the team with homers and comes in there and steps up and hits in the power spot that is sorely lacking otherwise.....Fans are dumb.
Think fans are tired of him being an auto out. He has tons of pop, but hitting 201/267/414 isn't very good. Like, at all. He's literally not doing jack shit when he's not going yard. I get why they get on him.
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Old 06-04-2013, 08:51 PM   #1379
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Quote:
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Think fans are tired of him being an auto out. He has tons of pop, but hitting 201/267/414 isn't very good. Like, at all. He's literally not doing jack shit when he's not going yard. I get why they get on him.
I get what you are saying and I sometimes cringe when baserunners are on and he comes up. I just read too many nasty comments on how he sucks when after looking at the numbers he is one of the few guys that somewhat consistently go yard. (or river in this case)
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Old 06-04-2013, 09:00 PM   #1380
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It's because he makes a fuck ton of outs. Mark Trumbo is pretty bad at the on base thing, but he tallies just enough hits and walks that it's worth running him out there every night. He's not a centerpiece guy or someone you want to build around, but Trumbo is productive enough in between homeruns to be valuable.

Pedro hasn't been. At least this year. But his avg/obp/slg last year was right up there near Trumbo's last season, so I wouldn't be shocked to see him pick it up in between homeruns as the season goes on.
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Old 06-04-2013, 09:05 PM   #1381
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Quote:
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Way to use what his team is doing as a collective as an argument for him. You're talking about the all star game, where individuals who are at the top of the game at their positions are showcased. Hardy is no where near the best shortstop in the American League. Whatever the Orioles are doing as a unit has zero to do with his case as an all star.

Nor, outside of his homeruns, does he have anything to do with scoring runs because he's not creating situations for them to do that. Throw that RBI shit out of here. McClouth, Machado, Jones, Markakis and Davis have been excellent at getting on base. Any asshole with as many opportunities as Hardy regularly gets could drive in that many runs hitting 6th and 7th. He's hitting 240/308/379 with RISP. He's tallied the RBI because of number of opportunities, not because he's any good.

Getting on base is important. When you get on base, you don't make outs. Outs are bad. Hits and walks are good. How you cannot process that and put it together that Hardy making lots, and lots, and lots of outs does not constitute him being a good player, let alone an all star, is beyond me.

McClouth has been good. Jones, Davis and Machado have been good. Go toot your homer horn for them, because they deserve it. JJ Hardy does not. He's one of their two weakest regulars, i.e., one of their worst starting players. How is that an all star again?
I'll take JJ hitting .260 with 30 hr and gold glove calibre defense over most of the scrubs teams are trotting out at SS. The O's worst players are the DH and 2b platoons..and unfortunately Weiters who is also 2nd in AS voting. Wieters value anymore comes from his defense..
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Old 06-04-2013, 09:05 PM   #1382
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I watch 95% of Pirates games and as many other games per week as I can....I hope to one day be able to hold an intelligible conversation with Damian Rey away from Pirates lore.
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Old 06-04-2013, 09:16 PM   #1383
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I watch or listen to every o's game live except when they play 10pm west coast games and I have to get up at 4 am next day...
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Old 06-04-2013, 09:19 PM   #1384
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I watch or listen to every o's game live except when they play 10pm west coast games and I have to get up at 4 am next day...
I catch as many O's games per week as I can. The MLB At Bat subscription has this awesome thing where you can watch a 16-20 minute condensed game the next morning so I get up an hour before I have to start moving so I can watch a few games that way.

They are fun to watch this year especially when they are playing the Yankees!
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Old 06-04-2013, 09:19 PM   #1385
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I'll take JJ hitting .260 with 30 hr and gold glove calibre defense over most of the scrubs teams are trotting out at SS. The O's worst players are the DH and 2b platoons..and unfortunately Weiters who is also 2nd in AS voting. Wieters value anymore comes from his defense..
He's hit 30 homers once his entire career. Gold gloves don't mean jack shit. It;s an award voted on by managers who are literally guessing and playing favorites more times than not.

I don't count the O's DH or 2b spots because there was no clear regular there prior to the season started. I don't think anyone was counting on poor Brian Roberts. Hardy was a regular going into the season.

Weiters isn't that good defensively to defend. He's not Yadier Molina. I think he's heavily underperforming. Shouldn't be near the ASG either.

You can take Hardy all you want. Never said you were wrong for liking him. I've liked less than stellar players a plenty. Just don't act like an ass, toting him around like an all star when he's clearly not, and clearly is one of the worst everday guys on the squad.
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Old 06-04-2013, 09:20 PM   #1386
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So the Inquisition finally begins. Now we wait to see what the Yankees do with A-Rod. We all hope they proceed with voiding the contract, but the Union's gonna have their say.

Cervelli being on that list will hurt us since we're getting Steward who's less than your average catcher and Romine who's still getting his sealegs. Which makes me wonder if we're going catcher shopping when the trade deadline comes around.
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Old 06-04-2013, 09:21 PM   #1387
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Damian Rey - Thoughts on Brewers shortstop Jean Segura? please and thank you.....I think if he was on a better team he would have a shot at the All Star Game.
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Old 06-04-2013, 09:21 PM   #1388
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I watch 95% of Pirates games and as many other games per week as I can....I hope to one day be able to hold an intelligible conversation with Damian Rey away from Pirates lore.
You could always PM me, sweetheart.
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Old 06-04-2013, 09:26 PM   #1389
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Damian Rey - Thoughts on Brewers shortstop Jean Segura? please and thank you.....I think if he was on a better team he would have a shot at the All Star Game.
I think he's a fucking stud. Brewers raped the Angles on that trade.

Definitely should be there. I don't think he's going to be hitting 350 all year, but as of right now, he's been the premier shortstop in the national league. Shame where he plays and his teams standings can hurt his chances.
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Old 06-04-2013, 09:30 PM   #1390
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So the Inquisition finally begins. Now we wait to see what the Yankees do with A-Rod. We all hope they proceed with voiding the contract, but the Union's gonna have their say.

Cervelli being on that list will hurt us since we're getting Steward who's less than your average catcher and Romine who's still getting his sealegs. Which makes me wonder if we're going catcher shopping when the trade deadline comes around.
Think catcher is the last place they should look. They would probably be better served getting another solid starter.

I'm interested to see how far Selig takes this witch hunt on roids. It would be amazing if Selig and the Yankees could somehow find a way to void that albatross of a contract and send ARod back on the free agent market.
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Old 06-04-2013, 09:35 PM   #1391
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Nationals with a killer comeback win. Damn fun 9th.
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Old 06-04-2013, 09:38 PM   #1392
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Quote:
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He's hit 30 homers once his entire career. Gold gloves don't mean jack shit. It;s an award voted on by managers who are literally guessing and playing favorites more times than not.

I don't count the O's DH or 2b spots because there was no clear regular there prior to the season started. I don't think anyone was counting on poor Brian Roberts. Hardy was a regular going into the season.

Weiters isn't that good defensively to defend. He's not Yadier Molina. I think he's heavily underperforming. Shouldn't be near the ASG either.

You can take Hardy all you want. Never said you were wrong for liking him. I've liked less than stellar players a plenty. Just don't act like an ass, toting him around like an all star when he's clearly not, and clearly is one of the worst everday guys on the squad.
Once in his career was 2 years ago in 129 games..and he got that gold glove for only making 6 errors..
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Old 06-04-2013, 09:42 PM   #1393
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BoSox are clobbering the Rangers 15-3 in the bottom of the 7th. Jackie Bradley Jr. looks like he's going to be an exciting player to watch once he figures things out.

Nats need to get it going. It's getting to a point where last year is looking a little flukey. A lot did go right; Ian Desmond, Adam LaRoche having career years, Harper tearing shit up, Strasburgh having a great year, etc.

I know they got a ton of shit for shutting down Strasburgh last year, and, with hindsight being 20/20, got more shit when they blew their chance at the NLDS last year. But that won't be anything compared to the shit storm brewing if they don't even get into the playoffs this year. Playing around .500 ball isn't going to get them there.
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Old 06-04-2013, 09:47 PM   #1394
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Went to the Nats vs Pirates game last month. They won 6-2 I think. Sad that Burnett nor Strasburgh were not on the mound. Andy LaRoche got a nice round of boo's every time he came up.

Since that game I've caught a few others. They have potential and heart ....I just can't pinpoint their biggest weakness.....yet.
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Old 06-04-2013, 09:49 PM   #1395
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Might also be Dempster's best game so far as a pitcher for the Sox. He's had games with fewer hits but either didn't last beyond 4-5 innings or gave up more runs than tonight.

In regards to the Nationals, looks like the team is treating him similar to what the Rays used to do with Kazmir. In the Rays case, they were really restrictive and cautious towards him pitching a lot but unlike Strasburgh, he didn't have a major injury until after leaving them for the Angels I think. They are struggling a bit record-wise but the big difference is the Braves being a lot better this year than last year.
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Old 06-04-2013, 09:50 PM   #1396
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Quote:
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Once in his career was 2 years ago in 129 games..and he got that gold glove for only making 6 errors..
Not a complete stat my friend. Errors are so rarely made and judged so individually that they're almost needless to this point. Errors also don't tell you how many times an infielder was bailed out by his first baseman making a nice dig, coming off the bag and tagging the runner, or keeping their foot on the bag while stretching to field an errant throw.

If errors were the only measuring stick for gold gloves, David Eckstein and Kevin Kouzmanoff would've won gold gloves when they played for the Padres. Kouzmanoff set the fielding percentage record for third baseman in a single season. It doesn't mean he was the best defender, just means he didn't boot or throw away balls that were hit at him.

If Hardy averaged 30 homeruns a year, you could say, with complete accuracy, you'd take his 30 homeruns per. Problem is, he doesn't. If you said 20 plus, yeah, that's about right. But you're stating it like he's a lock for doing something he's done once in his career, in his late 20s, which was followed by a poor season at the plate. Maybe he hits 30 this year. He's a third of the way there. But don't act like it's business as usual for him, because it's absolutely not.
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Old 06-04-2013, 10:00 PM   #1397
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Might also be Dempster's best game so far as a pitcher for the Sox. He's had games with fewer hits but either didn't last beyond 4-5 innings or gave up more runs than tonight.

In regards to the Nationals, looks like the team is treating him similar to what the Rays used to do with Kazmir. In the Rays case, they were really restrictive and cautious towards him pitching a lot but unlike Strasburgh, he didn't have a major injury until after leaving them for the Angels I think.
Dempster's strikeouts are good. I think he may just be getting a tad unlucky. I'm looking at his stats, and it seems like he's been a little more homer prone than usual. If that normalizes, he'll be fine.

The thing that worries me about Stras, and what makes the Nats look like they new what they were doing is that he keeps running into these little injuries. Also, they did the same with Zimmerman, and he's a stud now. I don't blame them for being cautious.

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Went to the Nats vs Pirates game last month. They won 6-2 I think. Sad that Burnett nor Strasburgh were not on the mound. Andy LaRoche got a nice round of boo's every time he came up.

Since that game I've caught a few others. They have potential and heart ....I just can't pinpoint their biggest weakness.....yet.
Number of things. Dan Haren hasn't been as good at the back end of the rotation as Edwin Jackson was last year. Adam LaRoche had a career year last year and has been struggling this year. Ian Desmond, outside of the power surge, has regressed back to his pre 2012 self. Gio has regressed, strikeouts are down, walks are up. Strasburgh hasn't been nearly as dominant. I think these things might change, but it's June. It needs to upswing soon.
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Old 06-04-2013, 10:09 PM   #1398
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David Murphy has just taken the mound against the Sox, who are attempting to score in every inning.
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Old 06-04-2013, 10:32 PM   #1399
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Munehori Kawasaki is the best all around shortstop.

Edwin Encarnacion is really heating up. Just hit a bomb for his 17th.
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Old 06-04-2013, 10:38 PM   #1400
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