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Old 12-31-2016, 02:51 PM   #241
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Cena vs Taker sounds better than anything i've heard them pitch so far. So logically you cant do it.
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Old 12-31-2016, 02:54 PM   #242
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Now that he is aligned with The Wyatt Family, Randy Orton facing The Undertaker could actually help out a few guys. As a result, that won't happen.
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Old 12-31-2016, 04:50 PM   #243
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I'm now for Strowman being put in the Battle Royal (I'd make that the Big Show/Shaq match too) with Zayn facing Nakamura. It'd be the rough one year anniversary of their Match of the Year candidate on the big show. It doesn't really need much more hype than "Nakamura is coming."

Any word on when Shelton Benjamin is going to be medically cleared? I know there are some that are probably "Whatever" about his return, but I'm quite happy for the guy. If he is good to go in time, I'd be all for him entering the IC Title Ladder Match and actually winning a Ladder Match at WrestleMania. It'd be a fun moment for the guy, and wouldn't nearly be as big a "WTF" moment as Zack Ryder winning.
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Old 12-31-2016, 05:30 PM   #244
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Cena vs Taker could be the last true "big fight feel" match ever at the rate they're going. They gotta do it.

Unless they can surgically replace every bone and organ in Hulk Hogan's body and let him have a go facing all the other legends from an era where they could get guys over.
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Old 12-31-2016, 05:33 PM   #245
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Without the streak I don't think it's anymore than the sum of its parts, frankly. When the streak was still there, it had this "Oh god, Cena could do it" feel. Now, without it, Cena beating The Undertaker would just "Of course he did" and Taker beating Cena would actually kind of suck. Part of Cena's charm is that he's been "the guy" for so long. If it turns out that he's just second to a dude who has been around even longer than him, it's just kind of...deflating.

Fuck, at this point I'd rather Cena and Taker team up to face The Wyatt Family for the Tag Team Titles. There's at least some drama there. Plus, I think that Cena vs. Taker, from an in-ring perspective, may not click as well as everyone expects two men of their stature to click at. I don't think it will suck, but I think there will be lulls where people realize "Oh fuck, this is a bit underwhelming, isn't it?" Let it just swim in people's imaginations OR just have them fight at a different PPV. I know that sounds counterintuitive, but I think Taker vs. Cena at Survivor Series, the birthplace of The Undertaker, in Houston, Survivor Series XXX would be a lot better for both men. Cena can properly heel it up, and it doesn't carry that "taking spots" vibe because it's fucking Survivor Series and it needs it.
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Old 12-31-2016, 05:36 PM   #246
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Originally Posted by #1-wwf-fan View Post
Cena vs Taker could be the last true "big fight feel" match ever at the rate they're going. They gotta do it.

Unless they can surgically replace every bone and organ in Hulk Hogan's body and let him have a go facing all the other legends from an era where they could get guys over.
I agree. Cena had grown on me. I'm starting to realize he puts on amazing matches. Maybe thats a bad thing. Maybe that means the rest of the talent suck. I dont know.
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Old 12-31-2016, 05:41 PM   #247
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I think they have to do Cena and Taker now. Who cares if it leads nowhere? That's not the point. It's a special attraction match. And like fan said, prob the biggest match they can put on.

Its been, what, 13 years since they've actually faced each other? That's a long fucking time. Get it done.
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Old 12-31-2016, 05:41 PM   #248
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Cena has gotten a lot better before our eyes, very subtly. He's now a legitimately great professional wrestler, as opposed to a guy with certain qualities and a lot of potential to live up to. His push is also less sickening (remember when Cena held the WWE Title for over a year?). It's been over two years since the guy has been WWE Champion, and he lost it in what was a smooshing. That Brock match helped Cena a lot, because it took out a lot of the pent-up frustration fans had with Cena being perceived as invincible. It was a cathartic moment that gave people that nut-off and move past how produced Cena was, and see how truly talented he is. The US Title reigns also helped tremendously too. It took him out of the main event picture and used his unflappable status to put the spotlight on some other guys by at least having great matches with them. It worked so well that they thought they'd try it with Reigns, but they've missed the part where he's not dominating the main event picture at the same time.
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Old 12-31-2016, 05:42 PM   #249
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I think they have to do Cena and Taker now. Who cares if it leads nowhere? That's not the point. It's a special attraction match. And like fan said, prob the biggest match they can put on.

Its been, what, 13 years since they've actually faced each other? That's a long fucking time. Get it done.
That is exactly the problem with a lot of the things the WWE does these days lol.
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Old 12-31-2016, 05:54 PM   #250
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That being said, I predict the match will happen. I'm thinking Cena wins the belt at the Royal Rumble and then Taker wins the Rumble itself to set it up. Be careful what you wish for.

As for what Styles does? I think it'll either be a match with Shane McMahon, provided they go with Goldberg vs. Brock III, or Shane will face Brock, Goldberg challenges for the RAW Title and AJ Styles actually gets Nakamura. It'd be pretty easy to set up -- Styles bitches to Daniel Bryan about being The Greatest Wrestler in the World Today and he wants to be in the main event of Mania, and Bryan says "Well, there is another man that many consider to be The Greatest Wrestler in the World Today" and Nakamura comes out and Styles looks like he has seen a ghost.

Either that or they'll just stick Styles in the IC Title Ladder Match because, fuck it, it's WrestleMania and AJ Styles isn't really a star, right? Remember that year they just jammed Daniel Bryan in there? Haha.
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Old 12-31-2016, 06:10 PM   #251
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Only thing i hate about Taker winning the Rumble is that he did the same thing in 2007.
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Old 12-31-2016, 06:11 PM   #252
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I cant buy your Nakamura angle, but i can see it getting put together.
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Old 12-31-2016, 06:13 PM   #253
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I really love the way Ambrose and Styles work. I wouldnt be opposed to seeing something built towards a match with them. How about a cage match? When's the last time we've seen that at WM?
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Old 12-31-2016, 06:26 PM   #254
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I assume you mean straight, traditional cage matches, because we got a Hell in a Cell this year.
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Old 12-31-2016, 06:29 PM   #255
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I could see Styles vs. Ambrose or Styles vs. Ziggler. It wouldn't have that much...oomph, but I could see it as a "Well, we need to do something" kind of match. Like how Orton and Kane got thrown together for WrestleMania 28. You know, the "Randy Orton match" most years.

The Wyatt Family vs. The New Day isn't something I'm too keen for, but I can see it happening. There could be some interaction at the Royal Rumble that leads to The New Day costing The Family the belts against a team. In my recently jumbling of names, I actually had it as Ambrose & Ziggler in my mind. They're in similar spots on the roster -- kind of floundering and could use a branch to grab onto. A Tag Team Title run might freshen them up a bit. They're different enough as personalities that I can see them having good chemistry. Maybe they can go against American Alpha at WrestleMania, with Ambrose and Ziggler being the more heelish team, which would be a damn good match.
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Old 12-31-2016, 06:35 PM   #256
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Styles Ambrose wouldnt be thrown together though. They could start right now. We just dont get many gimmick matches 1v1 anymore at WM and it would be refreshing ( WWE will steal this idea and ignore my application once again ).
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Old 12-31-2016, 06:40 PM   #257
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I should have used the term "leftovers." We've seen them fighting since September.
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Old 12-31-2016, 07:49 PM   #258
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No.

I mean, Styles Ambrose is established. They could carry a story to WM.
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Old 12-31-2016, 08:33 PM   #259
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Styles and Ambrose have been feuding since just after SummerSlam and that ended only a few weeks ago. Having them feud again straight away and carrying it to Mania would be overkill.
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Old 12-31-2016, 09:25 PM   #260
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Styles and Ambrose or Styles and Cena are their best options as far as Styles goes. A match with HBK wouldn't be bad but I just feel like the history he has with Cena that the money is in that match. If not Cena then Ambrose is the next best case.

I don't see the intrigue in Cena vs Taker. It would be a poorly thrown together program that would end up being lack luster. Of course that's really anything they do with the Undertaker though. Personally I think Taker, Kane, and Sting vs The Wyatt Family would be good.
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Old 12-31-2016, 10:05 PM   #261
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Cena has gotten a lot better before our eyes, very subtly. He's now a legitimately great professional wrestler, as opposed to a guy with certain qualities and a lot of potential to live up to. His push is also less sickening (remember when Cena held the WWE Title for over a year?). It's been over two years since the guy has been WWE Champion, and he lost it in what was a smooshing. That Brock match helped Cena a lot, because it took out a lot of the pent-up frustration fans had with Cena being perceived as invincible. It was a cathartic moment that gave people that nut-off and move past how produced Cena was, and see how truly talented he is. The US Title reigns also helped tremendously too. It took him out of the main event picture and used his unflappable status to put the spotlight on some other guys by at least having great matches with them. It worked so well that they thought they'd try it with Reigns, but they've missed the part where he's not dominating the main event picture at the same time.
I used to hate cena and thought he was extremely limited. His stint as us champion completely changed my opinion of him. He has put in some of the best matches I have ever seen in the last couple years. That's not all him but also who he was facing in his feuds but he stepped up to another level himself.

I've also noticed that I now sort of miss him when he's gone for long periods of time. He can carry good chunks of time and at least make them entertaining. Also feel like his only real drawback now is that he is shackled in the confines of his gimmick. He needs to be given that freedom to do something g different. I think he is more than capable and has a lot of acting talent hiding behind the surface. He could shine so much brighter if they would just let him evolve.
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Old 12-31-2016, 10:10 PM   #262
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Cena has been showing a little more edginess in his character recently that I like.
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Old 12-31-2016, 10:37 PM   #263
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Cena has been amazing the last couple of years. It actually pisses me off in a way because it's very possible he was always this good even during his Super Cena years but he was forced to be one dimensional.
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Old 01-01-2017, 01:38 PM   #264
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I was dead set against a Taker/Orton retread but framed with Wyatt in the background - two victims of The Streak trying to avenge their losses - I might be able to buy in.
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Old 01-01-2017, 03:13 PM   #265
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How about Taker and Kane vs Wyatt and Orton? Gets Kane on the card and simplifies that story.
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Old 01-01-2017, 05:50 PM   #266
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I really don't want to see the Brothers of Destruction squashing the Wyatts again.
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Old 01-01-2017, 05:55 PM   #267
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But it will do so much for The Wyatts just being in the ring with Taker, right? Right??
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Old 01-01-2017, 06:20 PM   #268
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Quote:
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That is exactly the problem with a lot of the things the WWE does these days lol.
And while that's a valid argument, I don't think it applies to two part timers, one of which is at the end of his rope and the other who's transitioning into a seasonal attraction. Not every match or feud has to lead somewhere. Taker Cena is one of those matches.
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Old 01-01-2017, 06:49 PM   #269
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I'm hopeful WrestleMania looks something like this

WWE Title Match- John Cena (C) vs Royal Rumble winner Goldberg

The Undertaker vs. AJ Styles... Really wanna see this match before Taker retires

Brock Lesnar vs. Kurt Angle... If Kurt Angle can't come back I'd replace him with Finn Balor. If Finn Balor is still injured I'd replace him with Roman Reigns. Roman Reigns could just be scratched off the ladder match, make someone else champion coming in.

Triple H vs. Seth Rollins

WWE Raw Women's Title Match- Charlotte (C) vs. Asuka

WWE Universal Title Match- Kevin Owens (C) vs. Chris Jericho

Randy Orton vs. Bray Wyatt (vs. Luke Harper?)

WWE United States Title Ladder Match- Roman Reigns (C) vs. Sami Zayn vs. Shinsuke Nakamura vs. Braun Strowman vs. Big E vs. Kofi Kingston vs. Rusev

WWE Intercontinental Title Match- The Miz (C) vs. Dean Ambrose

WWE SmackDown! Women's Title Match- Becky Lynch (C) vs. Sasha Banks (No idea how you get Sasha over there, so I'm just pipedreaming here.)

WWE SmackDown! Tag Team Title Match- American Alpha (C) vs. The Revival

I'm sure there'd be more matches but this would be what I would put on my main card.
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Old 01-01-2017, 07:10 PM   #270
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Quote:
Originally Posted by #BrotherVito DELETED View Post
Styles and Ambrose have been feuding since just after SummerSlam and that ended only a few weeks ago. Having them feud again straight away and carrying it to Mania would be overkill.
Yeah, I agree with this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Damian Rey 2.0 View Post
And while that's a valid argument, I don't think it applies to two part timers, one of which is at the end of his rope and the other who's transitioning into a seasonal attraction. Not every match or feud has to lead somewhere. Taker Cena is one of those matches.
Fair point, but then you are really selling the match itself. What happens when it is clunky and below expectations?

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Styles and Ambrose or Styles and Cena are their best options as far as Styles goes. A match with HBK wouldn't be bad but I just feel like the history he has with Cena that the money is in that match. If not Cena then Ambrose is the next best case.

I don't see the intrigue in Cena vs Taker. It would be a poorly thrown together program that would end up being lack luster. Of course that's really anything they do with the Undertaker though. Personally I think Taker, Kane, and Sting vs The Wyatt Family would be good.
I am on board with Styles vs. Cena. I think Styles vs. HBK would be bigger, better and fresher, but I'm board with Styles vs. Cena. It is my favorite "realistic" match. I'm not big on Sting returning after he lost to Triple H at WrestleMania and given the shape of his neck, but that is probably the best idea I've heard for him. They'll probably put the babyfaces over and have Wyatt go 0-3 at WrestleMania, but I still not shed tears because it is a big step up for Harper and I don't really care about Orton losing. It could lead to the destruction of that incarnation of The Family too. It is all about how they sell the loss. If it's business as normal for The Wyatt Family afterwards, it is death.

Styles/Ambrose is the only thing I really don't like. Ambrose is flat as shit right now. The crowd basically turned on him during his program with Styles. To give him yet another shot against Styles would just be tedious. I've honestly got no clue where you insert Ambrose in any sort of meaningful role at Mania -- his stock has dropped so much even with a WWE Title reign.
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Old 01-01-2017, 07:15 PM   #271
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A question about Owens/Jericho:

Who is the babyface in that feud? It feels very similar to the Rollins/Triple H stuff in that it would seem logical to turn the fresh young kid face, but thus far there are no endearing traits being displayed. Rollins didn't get confident and start proving himself in competition, earning the ire of "Daddy" who wasn't needed anymore. Owens is losing all his non-title matches and looking like a coward constantly.

Jericho's persona is honestly more interesting and he could very easily get pops by just rehearsing his shtick, but it is so obviously a heel gig. Whenever Jericho turns face all that stuff is dropped and he becomes Y2J Classic again. I mean, I love Jericho, but remember him from the AJ Styles feud? I was quite fine with him, but I completely got why so many people were underwhelmed and were like "Just go away, Jericho."

I honestly can't see how you get to Owens/Jericho when both have been such cowardly babies. I think Owens is better served as being a babyface, but unless Jericho costs him the Universal Title on purpose and really dials up the heat, I can't really see how people are supposed to feel too sorry for Owens, given that he is clearly using Jericho, and frankly dependent on him.
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Old 01-01-2017, 07:15 PM   #272
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That being said, given that it doesn't really seem to make sense, I think it is a fair prediction for WrestleMania.
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Old 01-01-2017, 07:25 PM   #273
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Quote:
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Fair point, but then you are really selling the match itself. What happens when it is clunky and below expectations?
Taker rattled off back to back matches with Lesnar that were great. Cena is on another level right now. These aren't guys who suck. Unless there's an early in match injury I can't see how these two don't come thru in a big match.
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Old 01-01-2017, 07:30 PM   #274
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And not booking a match because it might be clunky or underwhelming is not a valid reason to avoid a match. Even the best in ring talents put on clunkers.
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Old 01-01-2017, 07:31 PM   #275
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Cena has gotten a lot better, but he's not exactly the sort of guy who carries ring performances. Think about the lack of chemistry he had with Randy Orton. Yeah. I have no doubt the effort would be there, but I can see it being clunky and kind of boring.

Maybe they have the best match ever? I dunno, but it just doesn't mesh well in my mind.
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Old 01-01-2017, 07:35 PM   #276
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Quote:
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And not booking a match because it might be clunky or underwhelming is not a valid reason to avoid a match. Even the best in ring talents put on clunkers.
Agree to disagree here. That is not an argument that ring work is the end-all, be-all if you've built to something that you want to blow-off, and I'm sick and tired of all the same matches being of a "good" standard, because I think it devalues "good," but I don't think a high-stakes "dream match" can afford to disappoint, especially given how much Cena's current goodwill seems to hedge on him now being able to consistently do good stuff.
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Old 01-01-2017, 09:37 PM   #277
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He's been doing good stuff for a while, far before his U.S. title resurgence run. When he has a good opponent, he's just as money as anybody.

Undertaker is a good opponent. You make it sound like Taker is done and hasn't produced quality matches in recent history. He has. With Lesnar, who's reputation as an in ring performer has deteriorated in his second run. He and Taker tore the house down at Summer Slam and HIAC in 2015.

These are two of the biggest names in the last 10 years and the last real dream match left. I cannot fathom why anyone would be against it.

The body of work for each men speak enough, to me, to give them the benefit of the doubt. Especially Cena's run as a legitimate top in ring performer.

The build is already there. The biggest star of his era looks to knock off the franchise player of the company and take his place as the new living legend.
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Old 01-01-2017, 10:07 PM   #278
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Quote:
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He's been doing good stuff for a while, far before his U.S. title resurgence run. When he has a good opponent, he's just as money as anybody.

Undertaker is a good opponent. You make it sound like Taker is done and hasn't produced quality matches in recent history. He has. With Lesnar, who's reputation as an in ring performer has deteriorated in his second run. He and Taker tore the house down at Summer Slam and HIAC in 2015.

These are two of the biggest names in the last 10 years and the last real dream match left. I cannot fathom why anyone would be against it.

The body of work for each men speak enough, to me, to give them the benefit of the doubt. Especially Cena's run as a legitimate top in ring performer.

The build is already there. The biggest star of his era looks to knock off the franchise player of the company and take his place as the new living legend.
Lol, Brock Lesnar is someone very special. Brock can shit out masterpieces and is really undervalued for how good he is. When he works with Taker he does magic because it's Taker so Brock wants to be magic. He just tosses around mid-carders because why break a sweat and bust your mystique?

Undertaker, *sigh*, I'm just going to say it -- the dude isn't as good in the ring as people say he is. When he's got a great opponent he is great, but he needs that great opponent. You say that Cena is that guy, but I think he works with other guys that are great. When you have two guys that work to the level of their opponent, you often get a fucking borefest. Has Taker really had a great match with anyone that isn't great? So we're left discussing the greatness of John Cena, and I'd like to know when he last carried someone. Cesaro, AJ Styles, Dean Ambrose, Cody Rhodes, Kevin Owens, Sami Zayn and whoever else Cena tore the house down with have never needed to be helped in that regard, lol. Cena could keep up with them, but he won't be "keeping up" with Taker.

Sometimes you don't do the dream match. Remember Vince vs. Bret? You don't just do it because it is there. Your story outline for it means that Cena has to win, surely? Otherwise you're going to have a part-time Cena that was never as good as the legend. And if Cena knocks him off as the living legend, then Taker has to go, surely? And if Taker is still good why do you want him to go? Think about the crowd reaction if Cena pins The Undertaker at WrestleMania. Cena has been building so much good will. Are you really ready to go back to Super Cena? And think about what happens if The Undertaker wins. It's a continuance of the status quo, which is exactly what is wrong with the WWE creatively.

There are plenty of reasons to not want to see this match, lol. I've never been a massive fan of either man, personally. That's one. I feel like the timing is wrong. That's two. I feel that neither gets anything out of it. That's three. There are the directional problems I pointed out, and even if you consider them minor, that's four. There are far more interesting things for each man to do. That's five. I feel it will be a "Cena is the best" wankfest that regresses his persona. That's six. I honestly think the match will suck. That's seven. I could probably keep going.
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Old 01-01-2017, 10:18 PM   #279
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No idea why everyone wants to see a triple threat RAW Women's Championship match at WM 33...Charlotte and Sasha have had their feud, it was supposed to be done and over with at Roadblock: End of the Line, and I think Charlotte v. Bayley one-on-one would be amazing given the proper build and time on the show. Put Bayley over in a singles match at Mania and then after a title defense or 2 for Bayley at PPV's maybe have her put the title on the line v. Sasha @ SummerSlam. I think Bayley © v. Sasha @ SummerSlam is a good fit, especially considering their history and the classic they put on the night before SummerSlam 2015 @ NXT TakeOver: Brooklyn for the NXT Women's Championship.
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Old 01-01-2017, 11:10 PM   #280
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...and King of Lurkers Tournament Finals...I won't show up...
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