I actually have no idea what's in store for Cena if there is truth to the latest rumors that he won't be in the WWE Title match because Orton/Wyatt will be.

Maybe Cena enters the Rumble after losing to AJ and eliminates Undertaker from the Royal Rumble? I mean, he WOULD be the heel in a Cena/Taker match, surely.

Stars need to be squeezed in, I don't think Shane is a star as a wrestler in 2017. No need to force him in.

It is fascinating though, I will say that. I don't remember, even at the peak of the attitude era, having so many possible Rumble winners and combinations for matches at Mania.

Undertaker, Lesnar, Goldberg, Cena, Triple H, Rollins, Reigns, Angle, Braun, Jericho, Miz, Joe, Balor and probably a few others I am forgetting, could all conceivably be in the match and win it. That is crazy when you compare it to years when it was out of two guys.

It really is fantastic and WWE should be commended for it.

Out there idea - but maybe Cena ends up going for the Intercontinental Championship? First off, SmackDown's done a good job of making the belt seem important, it very often main events the weekly television shows.

WWE seem to at least be aware of the hype NJPW is getting, and their Intercontinental Title is viewed as a true 1-A belt with main eventers gunning for it. Having Cena go for that belt just as he did for the US Title a few years ago is something I could see doing.

Also, WWE like "completeness" in a wrestler's resume. Jericho winning the US Title was just made a big deal because it was the only singles belt he hadn't won. Well Cena hasn't won the Intercontinental Title yet so it gives him another accolade.

Have the Miz beat Ambrose at the Rumble
Have Shinsuke Nakamura win the Rumble but have him go for the IC title instead at WM and throw Ambrose in with Rollins and Zahn against HHH/Jericho/Owens.
Have Miz lose but feud with Nakamura until its time for Summerslam and then have Cena in the picture leading to Cena/Nakamura for the main title at Wm

If WWE liked completeness the would have Christian win the WWE title :rant:

Get the hell outta here.

Not really on board with Orton/Wyatt with the title on the line.

It feels very rushed. Feel like Styles deserves to walk into Mania as champ. They should've held off the Cena match till then.

Why would he do that?

Because there were some good matches for that belt in the 90's!

Taker and Cena run into each other at the Rumble,:. You've been hot for like a decade, I've been hot for almost three. Respect that kid.

Taker could eliminate Cena at EC. Or try to help him against The Wyatts, but it backfires and he costs Cena the belt.

Possible post-Rumble and Mania plans in regards to RAW:

Between that and the possible news of Balor's return being sooner than expected, Balor-Taker and Reigns-Strowman could end up being two of RAW's big feuds for Mania.

How many times have they made a big deal out of Cena winning the title only for him to drop it in the ensuing 2 months.

Because the last belt he had in Japan was IC title.

Well that would be a horrible reason.

No thanks on Balor v Taker. Number1, can someone tell me if and how much so was Balor over when he was on the Raw roster?

Number 2, I don't like the mismatch in size. I know that's a very old school way to view it, but it would bother me, for a big time Mania match.

Reigns Stroman makes sense. Two of the new generation guys going into a big program.

He was mega-over. Everybody loves doing that lights gimmick thing.

The entrances for Balor vs Taker would be longer than the match itself.

Per the new Wrestling Observer today...


Goldberg vs. Lesnar
Undertaker vs. Roman Reigns
HHH vs. Seth Rollins
Jericho vs. Owens
Wyatt vs. Orton
Show vs. Shaquille O’Neal
Charlotte vs. Bayley vs. Sasha Banks vs. Nia Jax

Dave is not certain on plans for Cena, Strowman, Balor or Ambrose. He said Cena vs Samoa Joe was pitched at one point recently however. He feels confident they are leaning towards AJ Styles vs Shane and Nikki Bella in the SD women's title match. He also said Wyatt and Orton could be the SD Title match.

Meltzer sheep,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

They had Flair win the IC belt off Carlito @ Unforgiven 2005...

In regards to Bray vs Orton, this is what the Observer had to say about that potential match and the Rumble winner being the biggest wildcard left on if Mania plans get another big change or not.

Even if neither win the Rumble, WWE can still use the Chamber match to trigger that feud into a WWE title feud.

Maybe Undertaker will challenge Ambrose for the IC title at Mania.

Wyatt getting help from the fam, Orton included, to win the Rumble, only to have Orton win the belt at the Chamber, makes sense.

Have Wyatt force Orton to show his devotion to the family and hand over the belt, only for Orton to turn the same way he did on Triple H.

What we know from this is that Meltzer watches the TV and guesses the Mania card every week. Let's see if any of his guesses change in the coming weeks.

Roman will defeat everyone he faces at WrestleMania.

If the plan is to have the Smackdown top champ drop the belt at the Chamber match, may I suggest Styles actually beats Cena, only to pushed into a chamber match against Orton, Bray, Cena, Corbin and Ziggler. Prob not enough faces in there. So I guess Ambrose could fit in.

Nonetheless, have Styles drop it there, but not be the last elimination. Then he can go after Shane and Bryan for forcing him into the match. Maybe attack Shane at the next show.

In regards to the Rumble winner, early betting odds are pointing to Taker as the heavy favorite overall, Strowman as the favorite from RAW, and Orton as the favorite from Smackdown. Won't be till mid-Sunday when the WWE tips their hand from the smart money bets flowing in from their employees.

In regards to the Mania card speculated by the Observer, a former WWE writer with contacts he still has inside the company said Meltzer is very close to the real current card but off a bit on certain matches.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">close but not quite <a href="https://t.co/KglcG1ms3i">https://t.co/KglcG1ms3i</a></p>&mdash; Brian Maxwell Mann (@BrianMaxMann) <a href="https://twitter.com/BrianMaxMann/status/824635594039001089">January 26, 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
For some reference, he co-hosts a podcast show for LAW.

Taker v Reigns for the title feels big. Reigns has to go over though. And I wonder if they pull the trigger on him going heel.

It'd work in the long run if they wanna keep Rollins as the main event level face, turning Reigns heel and building to a clash at Summer Slam is a good direction.

WrestleMania commentators
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...15b9fed9d6.png
Thought this was interesting.

Cole's being short changed on that list, actually. Was the lead SmackDown guy pretty much from the start of SmackDown, so mid 1999 through 2003 should all be red.

I'm not sure but I distinctly remember Paul Heyman and JR calling 2001. I'd be surprised if King and JR weren't the ones calling 2000.

Oh sorry the name of the graph is cut off, this is WrestleMania commentators.

Ah okay, makes sense then. :y:

I'm not big on Orton winning the Rumble and challenging Bray, but I can definitely see it happening. The WWE loves putting their Rumble Winner in mid-card programs. Welcome to the brand split era!

It sounds accurate because it also has that "zone out" effect on me, where I genuinely do not care about it. WrestleMania 32 was a surreal card like too. Feels very tone deaf. If Cena is not facing Taker, then I expect him to wrestle Joe. I also expect this show to go 7 hours.

I'm still not entirely convinced that Owens and Jericho split before Mania. The show is going to be long enough as it is, and there are so many "big" singles matches that I can see everything struggle to keep everyone awake. Triple H, Owens & Jericho vs. Seth Rollins and two partners seems like something that could definitely happen. I can see them saying "nuts" to alternative programs and just throwing The Shield back together for the match. And that would be hotter than most things they have planned.

Ah, fuck, the more I think about it the more I don't like this. It's not even that it's bad, it's just...meh. Like an upper mid-card program has just had the WWE Title thrown into it to try and give it more validation for even making the final card.

Orton toss out Bray to win the Rumble and Bray wins EC seems more probable to me

I'm also still convinced that the Miz/Daniel Bryan stuff will lead to a match but to take some pressure off of Bryan they make it a tag match with The Shane/Styles match.

Orton wins the Rumble after refusing to eliminate himself when he's left there with Bray. It might even be all three Wyatt Family members at the end. The crowd will go apeshit for it and Orton has won before, so it's not like he's not worthy or anything. It just doesn't feel...right.

By the way, Miz is not wrestling Daniel Bryan at WrestleMania. I am willing to bet money on that. If Bryan is medically cleared, why would you waste him on a mid-card heel act? He might be in Shane's corner as a coach/trainer to try and transfer his babyface energy into Shane so that he doesn't get booed against AJ Styles at Mania (he will).

The Miz might be in some sort of Ladder Match for the IC Title, or in a mixed tag with Maryse against Dean Ambrose & Renee Young or using his tremendous mid-card heel talents in the mid-card against a babyface they desperately want to get over. A match against Apollo Crews or Kalisto isn't exactly out of the realm of possibility. Miz has been pretty magic and could get that shit justified for Mania. Miz vs. Kalisto - Hair vs. Mask would drum up some interest. A pissed off bald Miz might even get serious and enter the Andre Battle Royal later in the show to get some of his back, only to get tossed out by another babyface.

But do not go into Mania expecting Daniel Bryan to wrestle The Miz with anything other than a surrogate.

Dirt Sheets were mostly right.

I think we are looking at:


* Bray/Orton/Cena (nothing else for Cena)
* Undertaker/Roman Reigns
* Goldberg/Lesnar
* Shane/AJ Styles
* Woman's Fourway - Nia vs Sasha vs Charlotte vs Bayley
* Jericho/Owens

Wondering how Raw get a #1 contender? Not like they've got the EC in 2 weeks. Tourney?

Honestly didn't give any of the Orton winning the Rumble rumours much "credit" because it seemed "ridiculous" to me...... guess I was wrong......

Reigns will say he was screwed and be #1 contender again.

Tournament. Best way to fill television the next month.

Potential Massive Scoop for WM. I also preface this by saying it's a bizarre idea, but...

John Cena/Nikki Bella vs Miz/Maryse was also a pitched idea for WM

RAW has a PPV between now and Mania. I'm sure all roads to Wrestlemania will go through there.

I'd like to see Miz do something else. He makes more sense in a match with Shane then Styles does.

Cena needs a program. But if the rumors of Joe are true and he comes up, that's the match to put Cena in. Gives Joe a big opponent on the biggest stage and Cena gets another marquee matchup.

I'm not sure what they do with Nikki. Maybe put her with Mickey James? Becky can reclaim the title from Banks at Mania in a separate match.

Reigns Undertaker, to me, is about as big a match they could do with Reigns. It'd be his biggest win ever. I would hope they embrace the crowd and turn Reigns heel. I think it'd go a long way for him.

No idea where Strowman goes in that scenario, or where Taker goes if Reigns goes with Strowman.

Any idea on what Owens is gonna be doing now? Who do you put with him? Balor? Not sure I care for that.

Erm, Jericho?

Would be terrible squeezing Cena into a story that doesn't make sense for him

Both Reigns/Taker and Styles/Shane also wouldn't interest me at all, not even a little.

I have to say, if that is the final card, I would be very disappointed

A fan on a message board, disappointed? Anything can happen in this great sport.

Lol, why can we not be disappointed sometimes though? There were a lot of positives, but I just think there were better matches they could be doing. Rumble was fun and all, just not fussed on that card. Not a big deal!

Just an overall comment about the state of some of the people on here. Not necessarily you specifically.

There have been plenty of people who've openly stated they enjoyed the Rumble. Not everyone is going to love everything that's put on in front of them.

I watched with non fans and it was really fun seeing their reactions

What was their favorite stuff @Dale Nude STud

My brother was real disappointed that Samoa Joe wasn't in. He doesn't even watch NXT and only watched TNA everyone once in a while but kept waiting for Joe because he seen a list of something posted by WWE on his Facebook and Joe was on it.

lol if true:

So whoever leaves WM as champ prob won't be on TV for long after.

Since it appears that Roman's now tied up with Taker leaving him without an opponent, I'm guessing Braun Strowman is the odds on Andre the Giant Memorial Battle Royal favorite, then.

Hopefully they can a title shot to it as an extra incentive for the GMs to try to motivate people to win the match. Braun/Lesnar or Braun/Goldberg for the title down the line can be fun.

Actually, Corbin and Strowman could be touted as the favorites for their respective brands and they'll show Corbin eliminating Strowman a billion times in the build-up.

Agh finally I am ready to post my prediction card....

World Championship
Bray Wyatt (c) vs Randy Orton

Universal Championship
Goldberg (c) vs Brock Lesnar

Roman Reigns vs The Undertaker

Samoa Joe vs John Cena

Triple H vs Seth Rollins

AJ Styles vs Shane McMahon

Baron Corbin vs Braun Strowman

US Championship Match
Chris Jericho vs Kevin Owens

Raw Womens Championship
Charlotte vs Nia Jax vs Sasha Banks vs Bailey

20 Man Andre The Giant Battle Royal
Featuring... Big Show, Shaq, Dean Ambrose, The Miz, Rusev, American Alpha, Cesaro, Sheamus, Heath Slater, Rhyno, Dolph Ziggler, Big Cass, Enzo, Kane, The Uso's, Sami Zayn, Titus O'Neal, Tyler Bate

PRE SHOW

Cruiserweight Championship
Neville vs ???

Raw Tag Championship
Gallows and Anderson vs The New Day

Smackdown Womens Championship
Multi Woman Match

Probably not a million miles off. I'd try to run a SD Tag Title match though. Not having them on the Rumble card at all won't have helped establish the titles/Alpha.

gotta love when they give the belts to guys that show up like once every 3 months or so.

also, please tell undertaker to stay backstage.

he should really call it a day already.

I prefer that to watering the titles down on a weekly basis with midcard guys. Honestly, Brock Lesnar and John Cena as champions make the titles come off as a million times more meaningful heading into WM than AJ Styles and Kevin Owens. Until they can manage to build new stars AND THEN put the title on them instead of acting like just throwing a title on a guy makes him crazy over, that's the way to go.

Really want the winner of the Andre Battle Royal to get a future title shot.

The trophy is neat, but give the guy some kind of follow-up story.

I guess this means Owens turns face though to face Jericho. Wouldn't make sense to have it heel vs heel when they could have just given Reigns the title to drop to Lesnar.

that's why cena was actually a good champion, best of both worlds - a huge star but always there.

I don't really mind the title not being on Raw every week either actually. Feels old school. Makes it feel more special. Especially since the current weekly booking only serves to make everything bland.

They'll never truly have new "stars" if the spotlight at the biggest show of the year is always on part timers who are ten years past their prime.

And no doubt if Goldberg is squashing Lesnar twice in a row, KO will also be squashed.

They've gotta build new stars the rest of the year and then have them headline at WrestleMania once they're over. As it stands now, they can't spotlight a bunch of glorified midcarders over massively over main eventers. High profile WrestleMania spots are the same as titles. You don't give them to a guy hoping he gets over. It just looks bad. You put some actual effort into getting them over AND THEN give it to them. WrestleMania main event spots and titles should be used as a coronation when someone gets over. That's how you keep them meaningful.

But then it would just be another Royal Rumble essentially. I'm fine with the trophy and maybe a mid card title shot because most the entrants are mid carders or jobbers.

Would be dumb if they had it any other way though. Would make Lesnar look even weaker if Owens had a 10-15 minute match with Goldburg.

...like they're about to do with Bray Wyatt.
Jericho is more over/closer to getting a face reaction right now. So you're probably right.
Trouble is they're not finding the balance. Styles is the closest thing they've got to an over Main Event level talent on SDL and he'll likely be feuding with his boss, a non-wrestler instead of having a barn stormer of a match with a Cena or Orton.

Yeah I don't see what they are thinking with the Shane/AJ match. Yeah AJ has had problems with somethings like the poster and John Cena but Shane said Steph and Mic made the poster and Cena has been referenced as DB brother in law. Really no heat between them and what ever they come up with would probably feel weak. Ambrose has more heat with Shane than Styles really does but the perfect opponent for Shane is the Miz.

wait, what the fuck?

shane vs aj?

makes just a very tiny bit more sense than shane vs taker

Assuming they go in the Shane v Styles direction, my assumption is it's a way to keep AJ in a high profile program coming off losing the title.

Dean vs AJ was the Fall program, so not sure about randomly bringing it back for Mania. I like the idea of Mania being a blow-off, so if they do Miz vs Ambrose, I think that makes sense.

It being for an IC/US title shot would be great for the competitors and the titles. Makes the match feel bigger since it was earned, and gives the battle royal winner something to do for at least the immediate future.

I think they gotta do something big with Corbin at Mania. I would like to see him walk out with the IC title. Ideally just one on one with Ambrose, although it would suck for Miz to but have a program. So maybe make it a three way.

I still think a multi-man Intercontinental Title Ladder Match is in play. Yeah it's been done the last two years but I could see Bryan wanting to keep the tradition alive especially since it was his last "WrestleMania moment".

Dean Ambrose, The Miz, Baron Corbin, Dolph Ziggler, and Luke Harper all feel like strong candidates to be in the match. Maybe Kalisto is in there too since he'll help you fill some of the required crazy spots they have in every ladder match.

Not sure if they'd make it exact 7 guys for the third year in a row. If they do and Tye Dillinger is actually with the main roster, he'd be a good choice for that last spot.

Failing that I could actually see Mojo Rawley getting the nod for the last spot over a guy like Apollo Crews. I think they see potential in Mojo and with his tag team partner being the winner of last year's ladder match I can see why they'd work him getting into this year's into the story.

If Reigns goes for Taker, Braun needs something bigger than the battle royal. He easily looked the most impressive in the Rumble and will be one of the guys featured after Mania.

What about Stephanie getting pissed at Smackdown winning streak and challenging Shane to put up a wrestler from Smackdown to go against someone from Raw at Mania.

Maybe do Strowman vs Ambrose.

Corbin?

Yeah I Corbin would be better. Corbin vs Strowman with bragging rights or something like first pick in the upcoming draft on the line. Corbin eliminated Braun so it could happen.

Nah, Miz and Shane is were the money is at with Bryan not being able to compete. Would really suck to not have one of the best storys of the year not have a payoff at Mania. Bryan could even be special guest referee.

I would be fine with that for Miz, but would want to see Styles in something more high profile than Ambrose.

Same here, keep him attached to Cena, they pull off great matches and work well together on the mic. Throw in Samoa Joe and you got a high profile match at Wrestlemania.

ambrose should fight for the belt and win it, cause he's the only one that actually wears pants.

Luke Harper wears pants.

Pretty much needed for their feud especially if its going to be the real main event of Mania. Right now there is no logical reason why Goldberg would want to fight Lesnar again and WWE already blew their load with the back-to-back domination Goldberg had against Lesnar.

Only real positive is at least on paper the US belt should get a boost in importance if the Universal title won't be around as much but then again it would also be typical WWE and RAW Creative to find a way to mess up.

shuuuut uuuup

Dunno. If I could get paid a hefty payday to squash a guy in seconds I think I would. The premise could always be Lesnar pushing for another match.

So Joe's on Raw. What now for Cena?

... Orton V Cena for the belt is still a possibility.

I don't want none!!

They're not gonna do that.

Cena vs Nakamura?