What's all this about Dick Murdoch being a Klansman?
Any info on that Gertner?

Gertner what is the worst thing you have heard anybody say in a promo to get heat?

I heard Brian Last tell Jim Cornette that Lanny Poffo once said something like "My opponents are going to feel like they have AIDS when they fight me. I'm turning fruits into vegetables."

That sort of thing.

I don't know if he was actually a Klansman like Killer Karl Kox, but Murdoch was definitely racist. He's also one of my top 3 favourite wrestlers of all time.

Well there's this

Hey Gerty, do you think Vince is past it?

Not completely past it, but he's getting there. I also don't watch the product so it's hard to base an opinion off reading results.

Stockholders have had unwavering faith in him, but I’ve got a feeling it’s going to change. Vince has been making a lot of “promises” he won’t be able to keep. The Raw ratings are becoming more and more of a story. Interesting times.

Ratings don't mean what they did even 10 years ago.

They don't and everybody seems to get that. But APPARENTLY, if they drop too low, it's still a big deal.

Not what they did, but they still obviously matter. More important than the actual share is their place on the rankings and their drop compared to other properties. Then drop in cable year over year is more closely starting to resemble Raw’s weekly drop, as opposed to their yearly one. It’s pretty shocking.

Raw is still the #1 show on USA and ratings across the board in every genre are down and keep dropping. Unfortunately since I don't really follow the product anymore, I don't have any numbers to compare and have zero desire to start watching again. Maybe if Ryback comes back. Message me then lol.

That’s been the case for a while, but recently the drop has widened way more than the drop in other things, I believe. Not sure where Raw places (pretty sure it would be way below Love & Hip Hop or whatever at this point), but SmackDown was down to #7 in demo ratings or something. Pulling that from the back of my memory without checking.

Getting slightly more concerning, if not the most terrible scenario imaginable. Vince is starting to get questions about it and actually promised higher ratings, which seems a weird pledge to make.

Didn't he blame wrestlers absences, even though there really hasn't been any?

Yeah, he did. The latest thing I saw about ratings was they hired a writer from Off Their Rockers and someone else from a comedy show and he said it would turn ratings around. May have been a misquote in the article. I can’t imagine him being so definitive with investors in unsure times.

I should E-mail Vince some of my sweet ideas.

I have a lot of sweet ideas.

Misread what you said about it being #1 on USA, Gerty. Sorry. It is #1 on USA, but #7 on cable or something.

Yeah I'm not too up to date with the numbers nowadays like I used to

Gertner can you think of a particular PPV or run of matches that I need to see? I'm watching the network tonight. Flair/Funk was one I wondered about.

Flair vs Funk is friggen outstanding. My God is it good.

Give Halloween Havoc 90 a shot. Really good ppv with interesting matches.

OK so the Funker it is. Halloween Havoc 90 is one I haven't seen which is odd because old WCW is my shit. I have time for both.

Hey Gertner, I bought a steel chair today. £11... Really I'd have been stupid not to. Should have got a bunch.

This is the entire "Storylines" section on the Halloween Havoc 1990 wiki:

LOL

Stan Hansen laid on his back, reaching up to his nostril and blowing a huge white booger out onto the canvas against Lex Luger will stay with me forever.

Crack it over the head of the next person who knocks on your door

It's quite good just as a TV seat.

Yeah I guess you could use it for sitting

Might hit mum with it then. Classic old lady bump.

OK how the fuck did Buh Buh not kill Mae Young with that Powerbomb through the table off the ramp?

Because Mae Young was a beast.

(Until death got her. Death said “lol You wanna take a bump in your 100s? No, bitch.”)

Still funny that Moolah died first. As a kid, Moolah was a Goddamn spring chicken by comparison.

"Because Mae Young was a beast" is a marvellous response.

You can definitely tell when Bubba was protecting someone with that powerbomb. When he powerbombed Terri, he basically put himself through the table. Lol not with Mae.

Lol Don Muraco is the most under-rated promo of all time. Fuji fucking with Gene and Muraco being Muraco is just hilarious.

Mr Fuji doesn't sound like a good dude from the stories I've heard. Mean pranks...

He sounds like a dude that was amazing if he was your buddy... but a fucking nightmare if you rubbed him the wrong way.

Like Andre or Dynamite Kid

I think Dynamite was worse to his friends actually

Yeah, Dynamite seemed like all around garbage lol

Mr Fuji retired to the town where I grew up in Smokey Mountain territory just outside of Knoxville. When I was about 13 I remember meeting him for the first time at Food City shopping for groceries, which was major for me because I was a Coliseum Video collector and was very familiar with his work as a manager... then I would see him at an indie show a few months later at the country fair where he told me he was returning to WWF to manage Yokozuna because Vince is going to bring him back for a championship run with Steve Austin... Yeah and then one time a few years later I went to the mall to see a movie and not only did he tear my ticket and point to my theater but my friend bought some pills from him. I would see him at that Regal Cinema a few more times over the years. I am also quite sure that my brother now owns the house that he used to live in.

You sure it wasn't just Lock Jaw up to his old tricks?

Wow, just got chills watching Flair/Funk in their I Quit Match. Terry Funk :heart:

I think Terry Funk is the greatest wrestler of all time

That was a pretty big deal to actually say the words out loud like that.
Good old Terry, such a giver.

Gave more to the business more than anyone

Ugh, hate referring to wrestling as "the business". I sound like some backyard indie fuck trying to cut an intense promo

Feel like I brought this to your attention. HHH’s “this business” annoys me too.

At least he's actually in the business

It’s true. I just think it’s dumb.

Although I do have almost 45,000 posts, so I'm just about at the same level as HHH

You're more like Undertaker to me...

Anyway:

1. Why is Terry Funk the best in your eyes?
2. Who is the best bumper in your opinion, past or present?
3. Who threw the best strikes in wrestling? Not potatoes, I mean believable soft shots.
4. Best storyline/s in your viewing history? Specifically non WWE please.
5. Has the gimmick assortment grown too big and shoddy? Old WCW PPV'S are full of real tables that don't break. It hurts my head seeing Stan Hansen do anything but once the bull rope comes out... Damn.

you are also a king of kings.

1. Funk is the complete package. He can work face or heel equally as great, he can work any style, he was a draw, he's amazing on the mic, he adapted with the times and has given back so much. There's nobody better. Flair wrestled a Flair match each time. Funk could wrestle technical, brawl and even bust out a friggen moonsault

2. I LOVE Sgt. Slaughter's bumping. I've always been a fan of the bigger wrestlers and Slaughters bumping in the late 70s/early 80s is outstanding.

3. Best strikes is Dick Murdoch. He threw awesome punches.

4. I'm a sucker for the Raven vs Tommy Dreamer storyline. ECW doesn't age well, but this is still great. JYD vs the Freebirds in Mid South where JYD gets blinded was great. Dutch Mantell and Jerry Lawler vs Bill Dundee and Buddy Landell in Memphis was awesome. Buddy Landell was great. It's too bad he couldn't overcome his demons.

5. I still remember the sound of Funk piledriving Flair on the table. The thud that his head made was sick. I remember ECW had some really flimsy ass tables. Wrestler safety is more of a thing nowadays and I get it, but still...

Dale would you mind answering my five questions so we can see if you and Gertner agree?

Question 1 aside...

Or change question 1 to Yokozuna or whatever fat fuck you truly love

Check out this match between Slaughter vs Andre in 1981. Slaughter makes Andre look like a million bucks and takes bumps that a man that size shouldn't be doing.

1. D-Lo Brown was the best because he was a big guy with the mixed skill set of a power wrestler and a high flyer. He also may be the most enjoyable combined champ ever. Theme Tune. Moves. Attitude. You're lookin' at the real deal now(then). He also ended LOD 2000 single handedly, so mad props.
2. Flair all the way. He shouldn't be walking.
3. Austin. The hype around him made his soft shots look elite.
4. Bret vs Backlund(I ain't seen as much so I get to choose WWE) So realistic back then that I hate to watch it now!
5. The cheap gimmick array was old in ECW in the 90's.

Why the hell was "Flare For The Gold" spelled "Flare"?

That bothers me.

Flair - wrestler
Flair - style/aptitude
Flare - pyrotechnic device

It's WCW.

It wasn't yet

Are you talking about his early 80s run or early 93 return

Starrcade 83.

You're right though it's just a misspelling. I believe it is spelled Flair For The Gold in 93.

Is it fair to say that Bobby Heenan's greatest skill as a commentator was making a mostly bad product palatable to an audience that was now not as dumb as the show?

This applies to early 90's WWE and WCW mostly.

Obviously there are exceptions to the dumbness but overall there was a lot of shitty gimmickery at that time...

He got bad pretty fast in WCW because he didn't have a guy like Gorilla to play off of. Tony wasn't gonna do that. He definitely made otherwise boring matched entertaining.

Quick wit, too. I've traded jokes briefly with him outside a couple house shows. I concur he is awesome.

Finished the Moolah Dark Side of the Ring. I like how they didn't pick sides and told the story from multiple perspectives. Very well done and it actually fit within the tim constraints.

The defence for Moolah fielded by her daughter, an unheard of female wrestler and "some guy".

They held their own though. I think the pimping thing has been over stated all things considered...
Wendi Richter came off as fairly dim if her version of the screw job is to be believed.

Bambi hardly if ever wrestled in the WWF. She was more of an NWA wrestler. Did a touring match with Peggy Lee Leather. They used to say Bambi would win in the ring, but Peggy would get her heat back in the bedroom if you catch my drift.


Wendi is such a country bumpkin lol. Love her. I don't believe her when she said she didn't know it was Moolah. Such a weird thing to deny. Like they had to call spots in the ring didn't they? Moolah has a pretty distinct voice. I'm convinced she is kayfabing, which makes me love her even more. She's definitely right when she says she was close to Hogan's popularity and deserved to be paid a lot more.

Yeah I thought she must have been in kayfabe... I do dig it when wrestlers pull that off in the middle of a straight documentary.

What do you reckon would be good stories for a second series? I assume Owen and the steroid trial/s would be on the table, maybe the ring boy scandal... Buck Zumhoff, Jim Herd's WCW tenure, Dynamite Kid's fall from grace, Arn/Sid could all be interesting if already fairly well known.

I'd definitely like the Chris Adams story told.

Adams for sure. I heard they are doing Dino Bravo which will be amazing. Owen is a given. Chris Colt would be great although he might be a little too obscure. The Ring Boys scandal would be good. Herb Abrams UWF would be amazing. Snuka killing Nancy Argentina would be awesome.

Off to look up Chris Colt

Yuck!

Random thought: If Slick came around today with that theme song he'd be one of the biggest things in wrestling

The Yakuza’s influence in Japanese wrestling would make for an awesome episode, but no way does anyone even remotely involved with that collaborate on it.

Just let Scott Hall and Jake Roberts make shit up about the Yakuza for an hour. They probably got enough shady stories they can just change names and cities to Japanese ones.

Would they ever open the can of worms about the whole Jimmy Snuka murder?

Listen to Jerry Gray on Cornette re:Jake The Snake Roberts and his piss drinking, crack buying ways.

CWA 1986 is my favourite thing right now. I have taken to the jobber Tony Falk who was on a "jobber can't buy a win" run.
The commentators are a lot more normal too, quite conversational in their lack of approval toward the dastardly heels. They are not over the top though, very appropriate because the matches are so hard and appear very violent.

The rings have a good noise, probably the first time I've ever thought "wow that's a loud ring".

There is a distinct lack of "typical Memphis bullshit" with regards to the silly characters I've heard so much about. So far the show has had a lot of very believable contests, and by that I mean the beatings are very convincing.
No heels are winning that didn't deserve to, they are clearly the stronger athletes and they get heat just by bullying the weaker guys.

The promos are tits too.

Gertner do you have any PDF copies of wrestling books? I really want a copy of The Fall Guys and supposedly it's public domain.
If anybody else has any wrestling books please pm me.

I have Bret, Flair, Foley, Ole, Hardcore Holly, Jericho, Gary Hart, JJ Dillon, The Bisch and Lex Luger but any others would be hugely appreciated.

Hooker by Thesz would be awesome.

Oi

Naw. I buy the actual book, read it and then give it away. I don't have a single wrestling book. I give them all away.

Imagining you saying that in a super solemn tone, staring off into the sunset.

I am high on my back porch looking at the squirrels in my back yard

I'm high in my house watching the hit show "Rick and Morty" for the first time. Pretty good.

Probably gonna finish watching the July 7 1997 Monday Night Raw. Over halfway done my 96 Raw rewatch.

Can you name some tag teams/tag matches from non WWE programming that I need to look at? I love tag team wrestling and since I only recently saw Bill Dundee and Buddy Landel I feel like I must have missed a thousand teams from territories and indies.

I like The Heavenly Bodies and they may own claim to my favourite non-gimmick tag match against The Thrillseekers in Smokey Mountain Wrestling but my benchmark is that I love The Midnight Express yet more or less detest The Rock And Roll Express.

The Heavenly Bodies look stiff but definitely are not, like Lawler. Dundee and Landel were just stiff and completely believable. Both had matches with almost no moves, just brutal one-way punches and kicks with the odd manoeuvre thrown in...

My favourite WWE teams all either work legit stiff or are just brilliant on the mic and do crazy high spots.

I suppose concisely I am asking who in the territories can I find footage of as a tag team that worked in a Memphis/SmokeyMountain/Mid-South AKA believable fighting style?

If you haven't checked out Murdoch and Adonis in the WWF please do.

Rude and Fernandez in JCP were fun
I actually love the team of Brian Pillman and Tom Zenk in WCW

The PYT's of Norvell Austin and Koko B Ware were great
Koko and Bobby Eaton were also tremendous

Check out the The Fabs vs Sheephearders

The Fantastics were another team worth checking out

Badd Company in the AWA were amazing. Diamond and Tanaka may be the most under rated team of the era

Thank you!

Right.

I just went on YouTube to find out who two guys were who got in a backstage altercation at an independent wrestling show and it turns out it was Lanny Poffo and some guy called Hannibal.
Moments later I'm down the rabbit hole again only now I'm listening to Lanny "The Genius" Poffo talk about sucking his own gigantic penis.

Apparently everybody already knew but just watching him discuss it openly has changed my perception and image of the man forever.

I have no question, just needed to get this out of my brain.

Lol Lanny is the best.

Hannibal. Ugh.

I know he's not the same Hannibal but I used to always choose him in WCW/NWO world Tour

http://www.vizzed.com/vizzedboard/re...2016_44_05.png

I love that the backstage scuffle happened because he lost his luggage and the shirt he wore to the ring was the only one he had and Hannibal ripped it off him.
That's great.

I must admit to being one of the few Wresting fans to have never played that game.

I've never even seen it.

I was never a "Nintendo" guy

Do you listen to Ron Fuller's Studcast Gertner or is that a silly question?

I love it now I've started listening, he seems like a very nice guy and he's very forthright in his account of his history and his family's history, he shares positive and negative equally well.
I don't know if I ever saw him wrestle but I'm going to have to now, if he told a story half as well in the ring as he does on the podcast he must have been fantastic.

So yeah, apologies if this comes off as a child asking an adult if they know their 3x tables...

I do here and there. I listen to so many wrestling podcasts that it's hard to get through them all. I was a bigger fan of his brother Robert. Very interesting family that gets overlooked in wrestling history because they never allowed the Apter mags access to their territory.

Nobody ever explained the Bill Apter figure four leg lock thing to me. Do you think it's a sex thing?

It's a really weird Bill Apter thing, but it's not sexual. I think Alter really wishes he could have been a wrestler, so he's acting out some childhood fantasy.

He talked about it in his book which was pretty bleh.

I'll bet he gets some sort of kink out of it.

I wonder who let him do it and who didn't. It would be amazing walking into his office and finding him with a dislocated knee because someone reversed it.

He has/had a belt called The Office World Title or something like that. When he used to wrestle with his friends, his finisher was the Figure 4 so he'd wrestle actual wrestler for his Office World Title and put them in the Figure 4.