At least in WWE's case, they usually just contact local indie people to do some squash matches or be security or extras for planned segments.

They used to get paid very well but then WWE cut the pay in like half a few years ago and don't think it went back to its pre-cut levels. Like it used to be around $400-$500 just to show up for a squash match and maybe a bit less for extras work. Think the day they cut the pay, they didn't bother to inform those people ahead of time.

$80 for extras is fucking ridiculous. Especially if you’ve been paying guys more than that. If he was taking bumps too and working dark matches, that’s just obscene. It also obviously wasn’t communicated effectively to talent. Rip Rogers, one guy in Louisville, knows of two talents with this experience.

Stop trying to defend this company.

You also have brainwashed AEW wrestlers piling onto the guy using Brodie Lee’s death as an excuse. Fuck each and every one of them.

I think Bostic may have even deleted his tweet. Bullied right back down.

Fuck AEW.

So WWE are pieces of shit too? Fuck them too. But stop trying to put the heat for this onto Vince and the WWE. :lol:

AEW are shitty too. Just fucking say it and be honest.

Traditionally yes, but in AEW you just need to be friends with one of the boys.

Or he might be fibbing about the extent of his AEW work since supposedly he didn't work any dark matches considering AEW airs all of their dark matches on Youtube, even when they were touring, and he's never shown up in any of it.

Cagematch might have some holes when it comes to smaller indies but that's rarely the case with notable companies.

Voices of Wrestling has someone who worked for AEW when it came to handling their pay and $200 was for the first night for extras since it was a very special night and $80 as the rate for standard shows.

$80 is fucking obscene. If I got paid $200 one night, I wouldn’t expect my pay to drop to $80. And this was clearly not communicated to talent, since both Dylan Bostic and Flash Flanagan feel stiffed according to Rip Rogers.

And if you want to see AEW wrestlers and fanboys/girls in full flight, fucking wow. The guy has received death threats and been bullied off Twitter. Besides hiding behind Brodie Lee’s death, all the victim-blaming techniques have come out. Britt Baker even said that the way he was dressed probably spurred it on.

Fuck this gross company and anyone that defends them. It’s fucking disgusting.

Calm down man

The point being missed is not what they ended up paying him, it's that they did not communicate that.

Before having him drive to the next town, they should let him know the pay. I don't know all the details, nor do I really care, but if they led him to believe he was going to make $400 for this 2 days, then they pay him $160, I can certainly understand not being cool with that.

What if the expenses and travel there and back ran him $100? If he was thinking he would bank $300 and instead banked $60, he probably would have decided to pass.

People get it. They just don't want to say anything bad about that company.

xrod making a lot of great points in this thread

Dave Meltzer tried to pass off the Jericho thing as 4 or 5 tweets. And then WWE got the blame for AEW being niche. You can’t make this stuff up.

AEW lives rent free in Noid's head and it's hilarious.

This debate...errr argument is so fucking silly. Take some chill pills.

With that being said....AEW rules, bitches!

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">This is amazing, I’m beyond honored to even be considered for this. Thank you <a href="https://twitter.com/outsports?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@outsports</a> ❤️�� <a href="https://t.co/ugS2TT51Sw">https://t.co/ugS2TT51Sw</a></p>&mdash; Anthony Bowens (@Bowens_Official) <a href="https://twitter.com/Bowens_Official/status/1343684764201607169?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">December 28, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

I live rent free in TPWW’s head and it’s hilarious.

I couldn’t give a shit if AEW dies anymore, and that’s a sad thing. And most people are with me. This shit blows.

Nerf...love ya bro..but I'm in the mood...(now that is at 225am Central Time) Who is with you, I know you started your 3 man stable lately but....who else? Just want to see who's on what side of the sand sir.

Cause I'm the devil in yall's six.

Can never think of a time my fandom was at such an all-time low.

You do seem unhappy

Yeah WWE is real bad.

wonder if aew will have a good ad on impact tonight. i wish bischoff was helping tony do his heel owner thing he kind of looks like dixie carter

I think Tony being a rich nerd who talks shit is a funny bit.

So, basically AEW fans are the wrestling equivalent of the Snyderverse and Gamergate?

Didn't see that coming (except I totally did. A dude got really pissed off at me when I said Kenny Omega wasn't the best wrestler in the world *yet* a few years ago).

Dixie Carter > Tony Khan

Really looking forward to the Jon Huber tribute show tomorrow. The card Tony put together is pretty great. I love how it's the Dark Order in every match. It will be a night of remberance and emotion for sure but also they could advance a new direction with The Dark Order. It's gotta be Hangman leading the pack now right? That would elevate everyone.

I'm all for Hangman getting roped in as the new leader.

Matt Hardy going nuts again and turning on Private Party to take leadership of the Dark Order is where I'd go with the group.

That would make a lot of sense actually. Matt and Hangman seem to have started up a feud anyway. Hardy could just go all Hardy Party on Dark Order and "Proclaim to be the new leader", but the followers could be torn as to if they should follow him or Hangman because they could have Silver and Reynolds pushing for Hangman to be the new leader.

Yep. It fits. Hardy was floated as a possible leader before Brodie. So it makes sense to move him into the role.

Wouldn't that make Moxley upset? Somebody turning heel right after real life bad news. Wouldn't want him going on a bunch of podcasts after the fact to complain or anything...

The Dark Order is the worst faction of all-time. It never should have happened, never should have kept going and exploiting the death of a wrestler to push it is a bad idea. Just let things end.

I’ll see your “Dark Order” and raise you a “Retribution”.

Oh god, this. So much this.

I don't watch either. But the execution for Retribution was not well done. And, in my opinion, mishandled way worse than that of Dark Order.


It isn't a "brand war" for me, but something tells me you will have difficulty wrapping around that one.

Retribution sucks, 100%. Worse than Dark Order, very much so.

Using WWE sucking to excuse something AEW does however is not a get out of jail free card for AEW. Just because the faction is "not as bad" as Retribution doesn't excuse Dark Order from being a stupid faction.

Truth be told, Brodie Lee made it better, but in the context of continuing the faction absent him, that makes as much sense as WWE continuing Retribution after how bad that has been.

And it's not brand war for me either, it's me mocking brand war by taking up the opposite side.

Here we go again.

Nobody here said anything about making excuses for AEW/Dark Order.

Noid said that DO is the worst faction of all time. I pointed out that IMO Retribution is a worse faction right now, let alone all time. You agree with this.

You’re not taking up “the opposite side”.

Please quote my post where I said anything you just waffled on about.

WWE has nothing to do with Dark Order. Criticism of AEW automatically leading to criticism of WWE is what I am criticizing.

Sorry. When Noid said “Dark Order are the worst faction of all-time” I made the assumption that “all-time” opened the debate to all companies, rather than his use of “all-time” meant “in the 18 months AEW has existed”.

My bad.

TIL that FTR, rightfully so imo, were not happy with their build to their match with the Young Bucks. And I have to agree with them. Namely because A) it felt rushed and B) the bucks turning quasi heel and adding that dumb stip that have away the finish. I also think that FTR should've defended the belts since they're the only legitimate heel team still currently on the roster that's championship caliber.

The Bucks should still be heel

They aren't overly likable as faces, at all

If I was Tony Khan I would bring Lord Gertner to be the Bucks mouthpiece, give him the tight pants, streamers and a wig.

They suck as babyfaces. When they were running down Hangman, they were instantly more interesting. The problem with that is FTR with Tully are also really great heels.

The Bucks being faces against FTR was fine. But they should've lost. And maybe go heel afterwards.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">I'm grateful for AEW Dark commentary <a href="https://t.co/4vmsrSNilK">pic.twitter.com/4vmsrSNilK</a></p>&mdash; still tired (@Maffewgregg) <a href="https://twitter.com/Maffewgregg/status/1344425879989084167?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">December 30, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Am I the only one that has been unimpressed by FTR in AEW so far?

I thought they started off really strong but it feels like they were built up solely to lose to the Young Bucks and have had zero direction since.

LMAOOOOOO.

Retribution is nowhere near as bad as the DO. The DO have been pushed and consistently featured since AEW began. Retribution was a bunch of guys with masks brought in to enhance the current roster. It’s nowhere near as offensive.

You gather all that by yourself from the tweets and clips? At least you haven't stunk up the Dynamite thread...yet.

I'll make sure your overlord Gertner gives you a rewarding pat on the head for this post.

That’s half the problem with Retribution; a renegade group hellbent on tearing down WWE but are polite enough not to cause any issues at PPVs, and then leave SmackDown alone before WWE signed them to contracts to appear exclusively on Raw.

This isn’t about being an AEW apologist, I’m really not that passionate about either company, but Retribution is the dirt worst in terms of current factions.

They’re actually functional though. They’re there to make the WWE guys look good. They’re not suooosed to be The Shield. They’re there to get their ass kicked. I’m not saying they’re great or I give a shit about them, but they were mainly there to make The Hurt Business look good.

The Dark Order doesn’t make any sense. It’s got a bunch of hacks (at least Retribution has got good talent). They were pushed as main eventers and they just don’t cut the chord with them.

The only stable I will hear in the matter is Aces & Eights, because they were the only one pushed so hard into the main event, but TNA sucks and doesn’t count.

Just positive reps for speaking the truth

Which other stable even comes close? No one can think of any. Very popular to just bash WWE when you’ve got no clue what they’re doing or just believe everything you get filtered through Meltzer, who has that anti-WWE bias.

People have thrown out Retribution. They’re basically a modern Spirit Squad designed to get current guys over. You can debate whether or not that’s been effective, but it’s just not supposed to be some sort of revolutionary angle like people dismiss it for not being.

Any others? Can anyone list a worse faction?

I’ll tell you what, the Inner Circle might be creeping up there.

For the record, the correct answer is WCW's and Master P's No Limit Soldiers faction. All 3 months of their existence was the worst! :rofl:

I thought of them, but I don’t remember them being pushed as main event guys. AEW actually wanted The Dark Order to be a thing. That trumps even the No Limit Soldiers.

That led to Del Rio leaving, that has to be considered a good thing :rofl:

Thought of League of Nations too. Bad and didn’t leave anyone looking better off. Nowhere near as bad as The Dark Order though. Just boring.

Loads of terrible ones for WWE over the years.

The Union, The Unamericans, X Factor, Million Dollar Corp...

I think people are obviously overstating Brodie’s run and how good it was. It looked pretty poor to me from what I saw, but he seemed like such a lovely guy who contributed so much to any locker room he was in. That’s what makes it extra sad that he lost his life so young.

None of those are anywhere near as bad as The Dark Order. MAYBE the Million Dollar Corporation would be a contender. But then you remember The Dark Order with its gimps, bad punches, Evil Uno shirtless, Brodie Lee in homemade gear and the guys that are numbered and it’s like...nah.

If you’re doing a draft, you’re taking MDC every time.

Maybe Brodie Jr inherits leadership of the Dark Order. He shows up 2-3 times a year and nobody questions the absurdity of an 8 year old running a cult.

Dark Order is about to get Rey Mysterio post Eddie Guerrero's sudden passing treatment. These guys are going to get over. There are a few great options for a successor to Brodie as leader of The Dark Order. Matt Hardy could easily make a play for the leader in opposition to Hangman who would likey deny the opportunity even though he'd be the favorite of the actual Dark Order. I think it would fit well for Matt to "force himself" on The Dark Order and further his delusional character while Hangman is eventually compelled to oust him and taker leadership for himself. Another option is Rowan, quite simple, he'd be taking he partners spot and given a big chance to do something he's never had the chance to do. Another option is to have no new leader but to heighten the use of Uno and Grayson as the mouthpiece and have Reynolds and Silver make their way up the tag ranks and eventually bring Gold back to the Dark Order via defeating the Young Bucks and Vance starts to ascend the card and become a more notable star which is definitely within him.

Not even joking, that would be great. It's probably impossible in this day and age to use an 8 year old on TV in pro wrestling, but instantly gave me good memories of early ECW when Raven brainwashed Sandman's kid and they would torment Sandman with it both physically and mentally.

X-Factor had a good theme! And UnAmericans were generic and unoriginal, but certainly not bad at all.

I do think elevating Uno and Grayson in the interim while they figure out what to do is a likely play.

I mean the whole gimmick was initially meant to be Uno’s stable with Grayson as his right hand man. Then when they decided to have an Exalted One they pivoted to Uno being the Exalted One’s right hand man instead and doing his bidding. I guess technically he’d be next in line to be the temporary leader.

Still love the idea of the Dark Order voting on Hangman as the next leader despite him not even entering the running. Hangman’s gonna face Kenny for the belt down the line so screw it, if Dark Order are getting a push it could work hand in hand with Page’s ascension.

Damn the gymnasatics going on in here to excuse the shittiest WWE stables is impressive. Olympic level.

Worst Stable in wrestling today is still retribution... and if they are only there to get the Hurt Business over well mission failed as they are both channel changing material.

Reminds me of Brian defending shit movies on family guy, so edgey.

There are dirt shit stables like Retribution but also headache inducing stables that plauged TV for years like "The Authority". Barf.

If you need proof that Retribution is a shit stable, they haven't been featured on the Hulu cut of RAW in weeks.

And if we're just sticking with comparing them to WWE groups, The Hurt Business has been on almost every week for months.

In a couple of hours it’ll be the 2 year anniversary of Noid starting this landmark thread in which he’s made over 200 points than the next highest poster. His commitment to the AEW brand is unmatched. AEW’s #1 fan.

Great job, Noid! :y:

Damn good commitment. He deserved to be nominated for wrestling forum poster for his dedication to foreseeing the next covid strand so he can continue to stay home and bitch about wrestling in multiple threads.

A list of some things I like and don't like in AEW.

Don't Like -

Jurassic Express. While capable of having fun matches at times overall the gimmick feels stale to me and I'm not a fan of Marko Stunt and Luchasaurus. I find them generally unbelievable and I Iook forward to a change in their direction. I wouldn't renew Marko's contract if I was Tony.

Joey Janella and Sonny Kiss. Joey was a missed opportunity from the beginning of Dynamite. The masses were never really introduced to his insane personality and he was regulated to Dark and job matches on Dynamite until his pairing with Sonny Kiss which makes no sense on any level. Joey had a lot of "underground" momentum from before AEW and it was completely left behind once he signed. Sonny is a really bad wrestler with a cringe gimmick on multiple levels. I understand that "AEW is for everyone" and the push for inclusion but this character is not working on any level. I would not resign either of them if I was Tony.

The PWG style. This includes all of the moves that Excalibur can call that leave JR scratching his head/hat. I absolutely LOVE The Young Bucks when they are on and nailing their awesome high spots. I think that AEW should be more strict when it comes to other teams/wrestlers "stealing moves". Limit super kicks for The Bucks, basically any move the Bucks do, nobody else can do them. It will force more creative matches from everyone else and make their spots more special.

The Women's Division. Shida is okay she's not setting the world on fire by any means. Britt Baker is obviously the best thing going in that division and should be focused on much more. Ana Jay is showing promise, the NWA women seem to be a solid injection. But they really need to stop booking these weak looking women who have no idea what they are doing in a match. It's embarrassing to watch. They could stop trying to have such a large division of women and focus on 8 or 9 girls that can actually work. They should absolutely get Tessa Blanchard and work a deal with Impact to get some women from them like Jordyanne Grace.

Things I love.

Eddie Kingston. He's been one of the MVP's of 2020 and I wouldn't mind a little more of him, even though I can't complain about the air time he does get.

PAC. I love how AEW has built PAC into a main eventer just on hype alone. Get Pac an apt in Florida and have him on TV more, please!

Archer. He's the fucking man. He has got to turn Babyface after seeing him on the Brodie tribute show. Archer is going to have amazing matches with Kenny.

Cody. No complaints out of me. He's a star, he's the man. One of the best babyfaces ever. I am always intrigued thinking about how one day he will get rid of that stipulation and eventually hold the big belt. It will be like when Tommy Dreamer finally won the ECW title. They could even emulate that moment to a certain degree.

MJF. JUST MORE MJF. Especially in the ring. He's. One of the best they have and he just doesn't get enough ring time in my opinion.

Mox. My favorite guy there right now. Big match Jon. I love everything he does. I'm not sure what will be his next program, I would hate to see him lose to Kenny again but it could be another screwjob at Revolution that sets up something else for him.

Overall AEW had a really great year through the pandemic. My favorite show was probably Double or Nothing, followed by Full Gear. DON had so many amazingly entertaining moments, definitely a PPV worth rewatching. AEW evolved quite a bit from 2019-2020, looking forward to what is next in 2021!

Do people actually watch anything other than AEW? Sure half the show sucks, but at least it’s only half the show.

The Bunny streams on twitch.

She's playing Super Mario right now. I'm in love.

https://www.twitch.tv/alliewrestling

Just now realized that she was "Cherry Bomb"...... met her once

All of them playing Among Us is pretty funny.

John Silver going to be super over

Over 100 million views for John Silver


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Already at 2.4 million views, has been trending on YT all day


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All trolling of Noid aside I’m kinda impressed there still making a go of this mid pandemic tbh. I get that bankroll is huge but lack of a true crowd have probably robbed them of some real “moments” driven by crowd reaction.

Feels like there still really having a swing and delivering some cool stuff.

Maybe it's time i start watching AEW.

if you can put up with the noisy ring roh and impact are putting on some good shows.

nice find. this is good shit

It's not perfect by any means but it is mostly enjoyable. Some weeks are 'just ok' but when they do have an episode that 'hits it outta the park' those two hours tend to fly by.

AEW possibly moving to Miami for February shows and ppv due to warmer weather

https://wrestletalk.com/news/aew-to-...ce-next-month/

What are gathering restrictions like in Miami, I wonder. And if they're more lax than Jacksonville, does AEW take advantage?

Why doesn't Shad just buy a roof, thought he was SOOOOOOO much richer than Vinny Mac?

Jacksonville is cold right now

I hope Kairi Sane makes her way eventually to AEW.

why don't you stop dutch ovening under the covers with nerfect?

lol he picks the weirdest shit to try to use as a "gotcha"

I’m pretty sure he is much richer than Vince McMahon. Why are you saying it all sarcastic like that?

Another puzzling xrod post that will lead to more puzzling explanations.

LOL you guys are so defensive you are dense to the "if you are so rich" joke.


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So now they have a developmental show as well? Maybe they can out draw Impact with this one, and cheer themselves on some more :rofl:

“Defensiveness” is DEFINITELY the reason other people can’t understand xrod’s puzzling, desperate “gotchas”.

What is your favorite NFL team, xrod? Is it anyone other than the Ravens?