You keep saying that I'm not reading, but it's you who keeps posting the same redundant point. Everything I stated pretty much relates to the issues involved with WWE having lower ratings. You keep dismissing my points and twisting things out of context in order to support your claims. Then you say I'm trying to change ppl's opinions? That in itself shows your are the one trolling to make your opinion come off as superior or somehow more intelligent.

It's understandable if you think WWE being PG isn't a problem, but don't try and state that as a fact. Alot of ppl could argue that it is a problem. Having the PG rating means they are trying to attract a younger demographic. Which is fine if they wanna sell more merchandise to kids and present a cleaner image. However, it also is ignoring the 18-34 demographic that made them successful. Being PG all but tells that demographic to fuck off if they don't like it. You honestly think it's a coincidence that around the time WWE got stale UFC became more popular? It's b/c WWE is trying to present themselves as something they're not. A complete opposite to the edgy, more cutting edge material they were presenting only a decade prior. For that reason, former WWE fans aren't watching anymore since WWE doesn't listen to their fans. When you ignore elements that made you successful, then you lose some of your loyal fanbase.

As I said, being PG isn't entirely to blame, but to say it isn't an issue is one guy's opinion and not necessarily fact. I'd venture to say some fans hate WWE solely for the PG rating. Again, it's in complete contrast to the style that made them popular. There's a reason that the Attitude era was one of the most successful periods in wrestling. The 18-34 demographic doesn't wanna see that PG style that WWE is trying to present themselves as. Everyone knows it's BS and only a convient way to make money off of sponsors and kids. The adults hate it and want the more edgy characters and storylines. Having a 5 in the ratings then and a 3.5 now clearly supports that conclusion...

I have this video on my channel :love:

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It can clearly be done without changing the PG rating as we have seen all year long. All it takes is creativity, things like R-Truth, C Punk, Orton stepping up, it doesn't have to be vulgar and offensive, that is more childish and normal PG show.

I don't want WWE to "try" to be cool, just be cool. And it can be a show for parents and children or anybody.

An example of a non PG Wrestling show is called Impact Wrestling, and I'm sure you know how that goes on a weekly basis.

This is still a pretty slow torrent. I'm at 78% with over 3 hours left to go still

His 7 minute reign was a huge surprise since everyone joked he could be champion but nobody thought it would actually happen although Triple H made sure his reign ended the same as Jericho's 1st reign that people swear occurred but none of the record books mention him as champion in 2000 :shifty:

I've never disputed that it can't be a good show with a PG rating. But, alot of fans, myself included, see that as a way of limiting the shows. It doesn't have to be offensive or vulgar, but it does have to be unique and creative. Both qualities that the current show lacks in alot of aspects. While some might see the Attitude era shows as childish or offensive, wrestling fans wanted to see that. Hence the reason the ratings reflect so negatively now. Do you think breakout stars like Austin or The Rock could've stepped up in a PG environment? I don't, and wrestling would have suffered b/c of it. Having the PG rating is like a double edged sword. Yeah, it cleans the image of WWE up and attracts more desirable sponsors. But it also manages to piss off alot of the fans wrestling gained when it was more cutting edge. To present wrestling as something it's never been before in it's history is laughable.


Having less creative and unique storylines is also to blame for disappointing ratings, but to claim the PG rating isn't connected to that is ignoring facts. Effectively, the 18-34 demographic doesn't like the PG direction, a thought also echoed even by wrestlers. Batista left WWE b/c of it. When you trash the formula that made wrestling successful to begin with, you can expect drastic results...

I am going to have a feud with Brian Kendrick for a while.

I hate him.

Also, while Im thinking of it, I watched SD today and the thought occured to me that somehow if Taker were to come back for Wrestlemania and he were to win the WHC, would WWE dare do MITB Cash in Streak vs Undertaker's Wrestlemania Streak with Daniel Bryan of all people?

Pure retardation.

Tag team wrestling used to be something you could put on a card and have people give a shit about it. The outlaws drew like a mother fucker too, and tons of the greatest wrestlers have emerged from tag team wrestling.

The only thing I can't defend at all is women's wrestling. The sad part is, it used to be better than it is now. I cannot recall the last time I saw a "good" women's match. Trish and Molly were pretty OK as far as skill goes.

The post you responded to was flat wrong. New Age Outlaws were hugely popular, as an example, and they drew money. I thought they were annoying. Not that it matters much, but to clear the record, I'd rather not be "generalized" like that for accuracy's sake.

I really wouldn't mind wrestling being booked for me specifically though, because it would draw.

Also, I'd like to point out that "drawing money" isn't usually something you can marry to a "does" or "doesn't". There are tons of little things that contribute to a product as a whole. That term should be reserved on an isolated basis. I mean, say what you want, obviously. You could say "Austin drew money," "So and so didn't draw a dime" if you wanna be like Ric Flair, but to take the entire body of tag team wrestling and say it didn't draw is kind of dumb.

I wanna know what people would do with the storylines sans the PG rating.

Let's hear your ideas of what to do without the "PG Handcuffs".

Uhhhh.... People could say Bitch and Bathurd and... umm... HLA.

Does it really matter??? Guys like you are too narrow minded to listen. Obviously, you think WWE is perfectly ok with the PG rating. If you've convinced yourself that the 18-34 demographic isn't vital to WWE's success, nothing said otherwise would change your mind.

Alot of fans I bet could come up with material way more creative and original than the WWE has. That fact is backed up by how often WWE fires or hires new writers. Ever noticed how often that occurs?

I'm not saying WWE is perfect by any stretch of the imagination and honestly, I don't care if the ratings are in the toilet, doesn't affect me, I'm not a shareholder.

I just wanna see what all these people that think the PG Ratng is holding creativity back can come up with that dictates a removal of said rating.

They can be more creative within the confines of the rating. These are 2 different points. But hey, Kane Knight has already been through that discussion and got nowhere.

I think we can all agree WWE isn't perfect. The only disagreement seems to be why WWE isn't perfect. To ignore the ratings means you ignore how far WWE has fell since it's popular era. I get to some ppl numbers don't matter, but small details do matter if you are talking about potential solutions to the problems. The only way to really measure how successful or unsuccessful those attempts are is ratings.

And apparently reading isn't a strong point for you or Kane Knight. I agree creativity and originality dictates their success or failure. Not just the PG rating. But, for alot of fans being PG is a turnoff. Especially since it's ignoring a major demographic that could help turn the ratings around. With them targetting the kid demographic, it effectively means the adults who hate the PG rating will look elsewhere for entertainment. UFC is proof positive of that.

As far as I'm concerned, you want to see how creative I am? Throw out a scenario where WWE failed and I will give you my solutions to them...

So you've ignored what I asked, instead opting for another "challenge".

C'mon guy, just humour me. Shoot me an interesting angle that can't be produced under the PG Rating.

For some reason, it bothers me when people spell "chittirlings" properly.

Even though it is grammatically correct, if it's more than two syllables with no apostrophe, you're doing it wrong.

Also:

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What they don't say is that the NCAA actually had banned them from performing the haka during the pregame, then post game, then within so many yards of the stadum at all because a lot of opponents (read: whiny bitches) were complaining about it being a form of "taunting" (no shit?) and didn't want them doing this at their school.

You know the NCAA; the same orginization that allowed Ohio State to wear those awesome Nike gloves with the "O" on the palms, but whenever the players actually made that "O", they got hit with 15 yards "unsportsmanlike conduct". Same orginization that somehow manages to screw Boisie St. out of a Nat'l Champion shot every year because their school doesn't have the market share revenue potential that a SEC, Big Ten, or Pac <s>10</s> 12 have. Same orginization that can strip teams of wins and titles years after the fact, but don't award the people they beat those wins. Sisters of the Poor still lost that game 35-7 , just to an opponent who ALSO lost. :rant:

So, where was I... oh yeah, haka.

What? They let that gay Seminole with the flaming arrow at Florida State do his pregame thing. That's dumb.

Supreme olajuwannaman

http://gamesnet.vo.llnwd.net/o1/game...24754_main.jpg

Does my war dance a scare you, Mongowians?

Don't get me started on that "anti-Racisim" crap. Granted, most of the schools were fostering generic Native American stereotypes, but FSU is actually ENDORSED by most of the Seminole Nation, and they (the NCAA) still went after them for a bit. Most they did was put a conditional ban on "the chop".

Yep, Chief Osceola can chuck the flaming spear, the USC Trojan and Michigan State Spartan can stab the ground with swords, and there's a ton of teams with cannons, but one choreographed dance number is just too risque for some people's sensibilites.

I wonder if a team that did "The French Mistake" pregame would have the same problem.

I'll settle for Kentucky hiring John Wall for all their pregame rituals.

http://www.gifsoup.com/webroot/anima.../1312479_o.gif

The same point you have repeatedly missed by insisting, for example, that it's not at odds with your argument?

Gee, I wonder why I feel the need to repeat a point you do not understand. Especially when you spent your last post insisting it was weird I was arguing with you when you were not disputing my argument, when clearly you were.

Okay, fine. So you got my point way back, you've just chosen to stick your fingers in your ears and cry "lalalala I'm not listening." And, in the process, totally distorted the argument at hand.

Okay, so you are trolling. Ummm...Congrats?

Had a dream last night where, since Hunter was in charge, he changed the SmackDown! set to the Thunder set, complete with thunder and lightning during matches.

How times have changed. In 2011, the person holding that sign would probably be asked to leave the arena.

Kaitlyn and AJ.

WWE_Creative WWE Creative



Tonight begins the Triple H Era, so look for a lot more sledgehammers-ah, spit-takes-ah and elongated syllables-ah #RAWTonight

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Damn, this got me pumped for RAW.

I'd honestly mark for Triple H destroying the GM once and for all with the sledge.

Sorry Lock Jaw. :shifty:

lol

:'(

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So I guess Rock is officially coming to Survivor Series.

From Rock and Cena's Twitters:

TheRock Cena fans: pls stop tweeting me to stop being "mean" to John. If u think I'm mean now, just wait til Survivor Series in NYC.

JohnCena Dear Dwayne, excited that you are thinking of attending Survivor Series in MSG! U can buy your ticket on sept 10th. See you there!

"Overrrrrrr"

Damn, I would not want to see an Arn Anderson/Kevin Sullivan porn.

I'd say not agreeing with your point and not getting it are two very different issues. Clearly you feel the need to try and insult me b/c you cannot debate the point sensibly. Your point has been made apparent you feel the PG rating isn't an issue. Which I agree with to a lesser extent. But, to ignore WWE pissing off the 18-34 demographic having nothing to do with the lower ratings is ignorant. How can you logically say the PG rating isn't connected to the ratings issue? You keep sidestepping my longer tirades conviently as well. Every time I raise an interesting issue, you keep saying I don't get it in order to make yourself come off as more intelligent. Ironic too, b/c you claim I have a distorted argument. To me, dismissing any opinion but your own is distorting the facts to make your argument hold up(which it doesn't since you never directly debate the points I raise).

You claim I'm not listening??? Weird you completely ignore certain posts of mine or take them out of context in order to make you look right in the debate. If you don't discuss the points b/c you don't agree with them, then that makes you narrow minded. I'd say that is dismissive and distorts the topic more than anything....

Tired too of seeing the word "trolling". It's another way for one person to state their opinion and accuse someone else of baiting them in. I must have a different definition of debating sensibly and logically then you do. In order to objectively discuss a topic, it requires actual conversation and intelligent responses. Saying b/c we don't see eye to eye I'm trolling is a moronic way of overlooking the issue here. Maybe expecting intelligent responses and actual conversation on this topic was setting the bar too high. Otherwise, it makes this thread one sided and not appropriately examined...

Itd be funny if they all got together again and reshot that picture.

lol

You can't challenge someone and not expect one back. I never ignored you, I simply was replying to your challenge. Wanting to hear solutions to a PG less WWE is lame and lazy on your part.

If you want to hear creative solutions, give the ppl here something to discuss. Throw out a scenario during the PG era where WWE failed, and I'll give you ways it could've been solved...

lol come on now

Innovative? Does Wade Barrett think he's better than Kanyon?

Wow... forgot this thread even existed. Why do we need this thread anymore? Most videos just end up in the 100,000 thread anyway.

Wow. Totally avoided the subject...just after bitching about others pretty much doing the same.

That "challenge" wasn't just for you by the way. It was for anyone that said "get rid of the PG shit".

One of your points was that the rating restricts creativity, all I'm asking is for you to suggest a storyline that would need the rating removed. It seems like one of those "fix all" things like ending the Brand Split, that on further inspection, holds very little water.

And how is it lazy on my part? Suely it's lazy to suggest a fix to a perceived problem but then not back it up with examples of how it would work/benefit the product?

In response to your counter-challenge (:roll:), off the top of my head, I can't think of a time that WWE "failed" in the PG Era - or specifically, a time that they failed because of the rating.

I would agree, were it not for the fact that you were only a couple posts ago arguing that you were not disputing my point when you clearly were.

Please, stick to one story. The thing about internet message boards is it's possible to look back at prior messages. You can't weasel your way out by changing the script and hoping nobody notices.

You're claiming that you understand the point (Which you've demonstrated you don't) but you disagree, though you claimed you were not disputing it. Either a shite argument or a shite trolljob.

Who better than Kanyon?

It doesn't hurt that most of these responses are "I don't like it, so getting rid of it will fix things."

The nature of the IWC is regressive rather than progressive, and before anyone tosses up the pained strawman that I think I'm blasting only others, I find myself doing it, too. Doesn't mean it's right. It's certainly something I try to avoid.

But let's face it. The tendency is to look back to the golden years. Things were better in the Attitude Era, and it's not so much because they were the right place and the right time as it is they were just awesome. People rarely look at how things could be progressively better. The answer is always "go back to (X)," or so often as to make little difference.

We need to go back to blood and major stunts and garbage wrestling, because the way back si the way forward. It's also pretty much literally the cheapest fix, though not necessarily the right one.

Kanyon has been working pretty stiff lately. :shifty:

Yeah, he keeps dead-weighting everybody too.

Hey KK, do me a favour? Suggest a time when WWE "failed" in the PG Era so that ccm can attempt to show me how a non-PG environment would have fixed the problem.

The only exceptionally bad storyline I can think of in recent times was the Edge Kidnaps Paul Bearer storyline. Yes, it was corny as hell. Yes, there were holes bigger than the Grand Canyon in the logic of the whole thing. I can only imagine that a non-PG version would have Edge going even crazier and bloodying Bearer instead of tossing pizza at him, but that doesn't change the fact that, as a face, Edge shouldn'thave been doing any of that stuff to egin with. So, poor example.

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http://bryandanielson.net/

I have just received an email from Colt Cabana :love:

And you quote?

Also, I have Celebrity Apprentice US on right now, Vince is Trump's Right Hand Man.

Hey,
I just wanted to thank you for being concerned. Thanks for being a fan and for your e-mail.

Colt Cabana

It is not a generic email Xero.

Well then what was it?

"Hi Meet! I just sent your shipment out to the address you gave me

Sent from my iPhone"

--------------------------------------------------------------------

It was a business reply to my request to change the shipping address.

Fuck you CSL! I am not that bad.

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Thank you for making me feel bad about myself.

Snarky Smarks and the Nerdy Bunch

Two things:

1 - Matt Morgan's out 6 weeks with a torn pectoral muscle. I wonder what they'll do with him in the BFG Series considering he was probably gonna be in the Top 4.

2 -

http://www.tnainsider.com/index.php?...&attach_id=407

How compelte does it has to be? Because JBL is poopy immediately came to mind.

I'd as soon not nitpick, but I think this epitomises the difference between old Cena and new Cena.

Onthe other hand, I disagree the problem there is with the PG rating, since PG didn't require them to go that far.

I don't know. I have trouble looking at the problem as a PG one, so thinking of what could have been fixed is a little challenging. I mean, the Nexus angle could have been fucked by Daniel Bryan Daniels choking out a bitch, but simply not choking a bitch wouldn't have really made that angle worse. That was a fucking awesome deal, which was eventually ruined more by lack of direction.

So I'm not rally sure what to say.

I never claimed I wasn't arguing with you. To some extent, I agree being PG isn't the only problems WWE have. My opinion differs from yours however that being PG for WWE is an issue. To claim being PG doesn't hurt them any is ludicrous. Telling the 18-34 demographic to fuck off and targeting kids makes no sense ratings wise. Especially since having that demographic could make a huge difference.

And I never have backed down from my opinion on the subject. Agreeing with one point you made and endorsing your views are two different things. Whether you agree or not, the PG rating pisses off the adult audience and limits them to a degree. WWE trying to market themselves as something their not is laughable. For instance, having Keystone Light as a sponsor and having Keith Stone on RAW. How exactly does that scream PG??? Just backs up my point that most of their sponsors are adult oriented and being PG isn't a real big benefit.

I like how you ignore certain parts of my debate to try and claim I don't get your points. I do know what you're saying, I simply disagree for the most part. I never disputed being PG was the entire problem for WWE, but to overlook it has a connection to the show quality is wrong. It's all about fan perception. Most fans over the age of 18 probably thinks being PG blows and start looking elsewhere for entertainment. The numbers don't lie here is the bottom line for me and major overhauls to the shows have to be made...

LOL
 

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dont remember that

<blink>MERGE</blink>

...Just embedded the vid, to be nice...

:-\

It was nice of you...but it's been posted half a dozen times already and we have not one but 2 threads for this kinda thing.

LOL I know, but it never gets old...it's LEX LUGER

...this thread will get merged or deleted anywayz...

The Miz is number one on the PWI 500 for 2011!

What happened to the chat thread?

It was moved to the community menu at the top.

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It's not a belt!

Wow, even the 6 year old saw Cena over Rey coming

A six year old calls it a belt, Vince calls it a championship.

IAmJericho Chris Jericho



Congrats to @Mikethemiz for being number 1 in PWI top 500! I'm so excited!! I can't believe it! My dreams have finally come true!!! Yippeee!

3 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply

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you won't haaaaaaaaave to fooooooooollow meeeeeeeeeeeeee

Who is that dude in the vid? Am I supposed to know him?

He's a darts player. So, no.

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_loybd8md5J1qe0is1.gif

Wish I had found this months ago so I could actually use it.

Oh, wait.

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The Immortal Tron is right up there with the Right To Censors for most pointless video tron ever.

I guess they figured just make it say IMMORTAL instead of trying to show who is in the group since it was likely to change on a show by show basis..also a great way to use the built in 3D software on their ACER computer from 2001.

Just an update on last night's ratings:

WWE RAW (9-10pm EDT): 1.5 adults (18-49) (4.484 million total viewers)
WWE RAW (10-11:05 pm EDT): 1.8 adults (18-49) (5.126 million total viewers)

Those numbers were good enough to take the third and fifth place spots for Monday night respectively.

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