The correct answer Rogerer, is the Smart People Forums.

It’s what happens when 5 years of bad television sets in.

Collision looks pumping. Will Ospreay defends his mid-card belt against Kyle O’Reilly. Another babyface match. Kyle’s done nothing since returning off a >1 year layoff. Fuck’s sake.

Speaking of misused Canadians, WWE has already done more with Ethan Page in a single night than AEW did in years.

And on the subject of Collision, they’ve currently sold <1700 tickets to next week’s show.

At least Konuwa gets paid for this shit

Frankie Kazarian has spoken out against the company. Inmates running the asylum, no creative vision, nonsensical storylines being the things he cited as informing his decision to leave. Kind of a “no shit” reveal, but still worth sharing. Kaz was figured in at the start and I think he had to wake up to how stupid the people he was in business with were.

Its def no shit. Especially the creative vision front. Even the die hards can tell. Theyve shifted their argument to things like "you just want there only to be one company again" when faced with valid criticism. And to he fair there are definitely people who do. Some claim otherwise but the vendetta in their soul is obvious. The point though is thats not a defense of the product. Its an argument about the argument occurring at all which is a type of admission in its own right.

You’re also getting arguments about whether something is actually a story or not — not whether that story is any good.

Any criticism of the promotion is waved away by some as “bad faith.” Chris Jericho basically came out and said that recently. A healthier attitude would be a commitment to continuous improvement and to actually learn and grow from criticism.

But it’s been that way for 5 years lol. It’s not going to change. That’s why I have no sympathy for the promotion or its fate.

I’m done with the “AEW is good for wrestling” argument too. More bad wrestling is not good for wrestling. Tony overpays for talent, which is a bad thing even if we’re supposed to pretend that wrestlers getting rich is the goal. Talented individuals will find work elsewhere, and might not have to waste years of their careers, amass injuries, develop bad habits, lose the motivation to continue after a well-paid cycle or two.

I’d definitely like a good product that is not WWE. AEW ain’t it.

Dave Meltzer and his little stooge came to the conclusion that WBD is going to give AEW a 50% rights raise to renew them. This is based solely on nothing but the two of them telling each other they heard Tiny say AEW is great.

Shows that have lost half their total audience and about 55% of the "key demo" over 5 years don't really warrant a deal worth 1.5 times what they were getting.

What is even better is all the other wrestling "journalist" are now reporting it as fact that AEW's new deal is worth over $115 million a year.

No new deal has been signed, WBD stock is down 30% since last year, they lost $3.1 BILLION in 2023. They are scrapping films that have already been completed JUST for tax breaks, and they just lost NBA games on TNT because they couldn't afford to match Disney or NBC Universal, which means they will not be able to demand as high of a price for their cable channels package, nor as much in advertising revenue.

ALL OF THIS somehow means AEW is going to get a massive raise, according to Dave Meltzer's opinion and other journalist reporting Dave Meltzer's opinion as fact.

At this point why are they still pretending this company is an actual business? Just say you love pro wrestling and you are willing to fund it yourself for the love of the sport. Instead part of Tony's pro wrestling hobby/fantasy is that he needs everybody to believe he is a successful businessman so he can go on NFL Network and Rich Eisen and fawn over how successful he is.

Make no mistake, Tony Khan is the reason AEW is such shit. He is so awkward and unlikable and delusional that it is impossible to take anything AEW does seriously. At the end of the day, he does not deserve the false sense of accomplishment, he is nothing but a manchild with a very rich father who never told his kids no.

You’re spot on the money there. I’m still thinking WBD just drops them. It doesn’t sound like they make a profit on the show (from Alvarez and Thurston’s own lips), and the content is needlessly violent. Skye Blue wrapped in barbed wire is not a good look. Neither are belts with your corporate logos on them being trotted out in front of 10% full buildings.

A new deal is also going to see decreasing ratings over the duration of that time, and that doesn’t even factor in what happens if WWE decides to play harder opposition and/or TNA gets a reputable deal. Who wants to be the executive that signs off on that just to see the bottom fall out?

Plus they have to know what a pain it is to deal with Tony Khan and what a mess AEW is politically.

No one else wants it. No one picked up ROH. If you were interested in getting Dynamite from WBD’s clutches, why wouldn’t you pick up ROH for some sort of bargain in order to begin a relationship with TK? Every single entity (except for allegedly CW) passed on ROH. Good luck landing a deal with the CW now.

I’m sure people will tell me that I’m wrong and I just don’t understand television like Dave Meltzer — just like I didn’t understand video games like Kenny Omega — but we’ll see.

I just heard the funniest excerpt about TK talking about Bryan Danielson’s contract coming up. Tony said he hopes he and Bryan can talk to each other every day for the rest of their lives. :lol:

Just saw a photo of Jericho with the FTW title....... why is that still a thing.................

Are you sure about that? It doesn't sound right. I can't imagine a reason that WBD would lose money on the deal. I suppose there could be requirements for original programming or something, but even if it's out of contratual obligation there's not many shows that can pump out that much live TV and perform that consistently in ratings. Even in that made up scenario where they're losing money on AEW it still wouldn't make sense to get rid of it. Does that make any sense to you?

Jericho’s ego. They’ve got to think of ways to shoehorn him onto programming. Has he helped out one single wrestler in the last 4 years?

It’s funny to hear Meltzer and Alvarez still defend Jericho every chance they get. Gotta keep those Christmas gifts coming. It’s made me reflect on the coverage Jericho has ever gotten, and how bullshit it all was. Dave has been doing his bidding since 1998.

Jericho’s probably always been a political animal and piece of shit. It just didn’t get covered.

Help me I think I'm a ghost


aaaaaaahhhhh

So Ricky Starks let it be known he is not injured and doesn't know why he isn't being booked.

A reporter asked Tony Khan about this.

Tony Khan said:

"I think Ricky Starks is tremendous,"Khan said. "I'd love to get him involved and back in AEW anytime. He's been a huge part of what we've done here for about four out of the five years"

This dumdum forgot he is the booker, Ricky isn't there because Tiny stopped booking him...

Good job, XRod!!

Cody guy.

Punk guy.

Presumably didn’t sign an extension even after receiving the gift of working Jericho.

Invited guest to WrestleMania.

Careful, AEW — your bullshit is showing.

I think this and all other conversations are moot when they’re losing TV, no?

378k for Collision. And according to Dave Meltzer, Triple H is kicking himself for not getting Will Ospreay.

Will Ospreay is like reboot Kenny Omega to Meltzer. He can hype Will up ever more than he ever did Kenny, and it is like Dave is reliving his golden years.

He can do good flips, like that is what matters! That is why Reggie/Skrypts was WWE Champion a bunch of times!

Yeah, Dave’s anointed ones don’t have much appeal.

His comments about Triple H kicking himself for missing out on Ospreay have not aged well.

Tony Khan announcing Christopher Daniels as the new babyface authority figure and then sticking around to make matches anyway is funny.

Holy sh*t, Harley Cameron.

So MJF's big return angle is the DX schilling merch schtick and fighting Rush? That is what Tiny came up with after 6 months lol

Things are obviously booked on the fly. Even if thought he tells the wrong stories, he tells the wrong stories poorly. If you knew you were getting MJF back by this point in time, why wouldn’t you have someone built up for him?

MJF is going to lose steam extra-fast in this run. He made the mistake of dangling scenarios people actually want to see out there, then chose the safe, predictable option. He’s got no one fresh to work a top tier program with.

If you look back at MJF’s work — yes, his promos are fun and the guy can work — but has he actually had a good feud outside Cody or CM Punk? And there were definitely problems with the Cody feud. He’s not going to get the “poor MJF, let’s support him while he’s stuck there” goodwill.

The schilling merch thing, even when done to be "meta," is so annoying. What happened to coming out in your new t-shirt and being so badass that everyone has to have it?

They might get a few hundred shirts out of it. Way worth the hit to the dignity.

790k for Dynamite. No competition and the advertised return of their biggest star. He teamed with the BCC for the first time on Dynamite! And MJF returned as well.

It’s probs not going to get better, folks.

OMG RIP!!11

Rush rules. I'm happy to get him into a program with someone important like MJF.

Stop having fun.

See, Noid didn't say anything bad yet the anti-Noid drave comes in and jumps all over it, and makes the thread not fun by not being chill and instead choosing to make snarky comments designed to spread negative energy

Adam Copeland wouldn't have a broken leg if he wasn't having so much fun :rofl:

My fun is to tell the truth about AEW. If drave truly supported fun, he wouldn’t try to censor that. But it’s about conforming, and there is less and less reason to do so, and so it takes the form of empty rhetoric.

Fewer people seem to be having fun with this product. And how fun is it going to be if it’s yanked off the air?

I responded to Vito. :n:

Collision looks like it’s going to be a pumping show.

* The ironic piss-take of pro-wrestling, Orange Cassidy, takes on the homeless looking man who hasn’t won anything in over 2 years, Kyle O’Reilly. The only question doesn’t pertain to the outcome, but rather to whether or not KOR wishes he could go back to WWE or if he is happy being a whore for TK’s money.

* Claudio Castagnoli teams up with Wheeler Yuta, who is still somehow a champion after being out for 4 months to face FTR, who now get booed because everyone knows what an obnoxious worm Dax Harwood is. The fans are punished no matter who wins this one.

This leads into Dynamite:

* Will Ospreay faces Rey Fenix in a match where chances that both leave healthy are the risky bet. It’s great Willy Go-Home went over Danielson just to flop around in the mid-card. Gotta earn those stripes through that grind, bruv.

* Mercedes Mone defends her TBS Championship against Zeuxis. There’s not much to say about her because no one cares who she is. If Mercedes loses her TBS Title, her match against whoever the fuck her opponent at Forbidden Door is will only be for one of the other 8 belts floating around this match. Drama.

* Rush will also be in action. Catch him before his endless stream of matches against Santos Escobar on SmackDown this fall.

What a tremendous week of action. Don’t miss it because it certainly won’t mean anything next week.

Pantogon, Jr’s contract with AEW is almost up. Someone is spreading rumors that WWE is interested in him. I’d doubt that on a talent level — the dude sucks — but I could see WWE poaching him just to take a guy who has been there from the start. I guess he could be used in the TNA stuff and could get a brief X-Division Title run or something.

But if the rumors are bullshit (likely), he definitely seems to be wanting to drive up his own asking price to rip off Tony or register his unhappiness.

Getting real about Forbidden Door: You’d think there would be some show-to-show stories to tell, since you have these people show up out of the blue and derail the usual serialized content. There should be one guy who has been really successful from the New Japan side looking for a real challenger, for example. Fans need something familiar to hook onto it. But it seems random every year.

You also have these built in stories that Tony just misses. It’s one of the more frustrating parts of his booking, because I think your average viewer picks up on what’s being missed.

Will Ospreay and Okada just signed with AEW. Wouldn’t it be logical for their betrayal of NJPW to factor into their Forbidden Door program? Shouldn’t someone from New Japan be like “Hey Okada — you were the ace and now you’ve turned your back on your home for dirty American money.”

Jack Perry was the Scapegoat in New Japan a few months ago. Instead of bringing him back ahead of the PPV, which wasn’t urgent at all, wouldn’t it make more sense to have had him challenge someone from AEW for his status back? I’m not a fan of the guy, but at least he’s a familiar face with a storyline reason to use the Forbidden Door.

All these low hanging fruits are going to be missed. Ospreay is challenging for the World Title the PPV before Wembley — so he’s either going to lose en route or cut off Swerve’s nuts. Jack Perry is going towards a random Ladder Match advertised to feature two losers. Okada isn’t booked yet, but you can basically place a bet that it’s going to be a random match that doesn’t mean anywhere near what Okada being on an AEW/NJPW crossover show should.

I just knew TPWW would be back up today. It needs to be around to register the week when Dynamite got 502k viewers.

I had to come here for some sane takes on that. Smeat at the other forums trying to say the ratings tanked because Black Panther was the lead in and not Big Bang Theory and I just can't even entertain that nonsense.

Like...assuming that's the actual reason, then that's even more embarrassing for AEW. Almost a third of AEWs ratings rely on people passing out to sitcom reruns at 7:30 on a Wednesday. I mean they had to be asleep right? Because otherwise they are just too dumb to flip over to TBS at 8. It couldn't possibly be that they just don't care about AEW enough to hit 2 buttons on the remote.

Remember like a week ago Tony Khan and Dave Meltzer said WWE leaks fake fast national ratings to make AEW look bad.

Then sudddenly fake NXT ratings came out saying NXT did like 517,000 which ended up being wrong, and NXT did like 770,000?

And now AEW gets even worse than the fake NXT numbers LOL.

Tiny Klown deserves every second of this embarassment.

Yeah, Bubba Ray came out and tried to do the moral beacon thing of “no one roots against wrestling companies if they’re a fan.” It’s just a fine “told you so” moment. They’re assholes who have been talking shit and keeping trying to force things down fans’ throats (both on-air and via dirt sheets) they don’t want.

The bottom was always going to drop out. It’s jarring how drastic it was this week, but the product has been obnoxiously defiant of fans’ tastes for a long time now. There was the “everything is awesome” stage. You say something bad about AEW and you get attacked. There was the “arms folded” stage. People were there but were more aware that this wasn’t very good. Now they’re actually being run off by the poor programming.

Sure, some things can contribute to lower ratings. NXT has gotten some hype lately. Maybe some people did want to sit on their porch doing nothing. But most shows were up. It’s really as simple as the shitty show got shitty ratings.

For those who missed it, Dave Meltzer tried to blame the nice weather for the ratings being low. That’s not a joke.

It's Steaming hot in like 3/4 of the country. Sorry Davey, ratings would go up because more people would be inclined to watch it because they were inside because of the warm weather.

Yeah the whole "don't be Tribal, all wrestling should be fun" argument is great when AEW is down, but they NEVER stop encouraging exactly that, Tribalism. This same week Tiny Klown is giving interviews talking about how he was so happy to give Sting a proper retirement because FEDBAD did a bad job with Sting.

Meltzer doesn’t help with the tribalism with his lies. In response to the rating this week, he even had what he called “spin stats” ready to go help people defend the company. :lol:

I’ve got no problem with a little trash talk…if it’s effective. But AEW has always sucked at taking the shots it does. Especially when they cry about getting it back.

I didn't watch Dynamite last week so the low rating is my fault.

My bad, everyone!

WWE Main Event is probably outdrawing Dynamite now for real

Main Event was the only rasslin show I could watch for years without cable. Didn't know it was still on. Good for them!

NXT Lvl Up whoopin’ that ass.

AEW booking is so meaningless they made Neville vs Daniel Bryan irrelevant.

Gotta announce who is randomly selected to be on team AEW for Blood and Guts! Don't worry, I am sure it will be as logical as booking MJF's grand return to fight Rush and Hechicero!!!

Britt Baker out a year. Let's book her to return coming for the secondary title LOL

best ending to an aew show in ages

best ending to an aew show in ages

So what are they going to do at Wembley? Beat Ospreay or blow off MJF’s heat?

MJF is obviously better off as a heel. It’s good for them to admit that the face run was a bad idea. Probably sabotage. You can’t just go back to what once had potential though. This feels a bit like deja vu.

My favorite AEW story lately was probably Tony taking time on the Observer to pretend there’s nothing to the ratings drop. If it wasn’t a big deal, why take the spot? And Dave sounded like the dog from Up slobbering all over Tony. “Oh yes, Master — the ratings did rebound, oh yes they truly did.”

Ricky Starks getting the fake story leaked from inside the company is rich too.

MJF might regret saying he cared about Nielsen ratings. I’m sure Meltzer marked out for the attention though.

I like the way they’re desperate to make Collision mean something, so they use Adam Page who should have been fired. Why did The Bucks suspend him just to put him in the tournament anyway?

I’m grouping Dave Meltzer in with AEW now. Two pretty telling incidents with Kayla Braxton and Pat McAfee the past couple of weeks. It shows that Dave not only can’t communicate with those talents, but he also doesn’t know anyone who is friends with them.

Dave Scherer has been destroying Dave for lying about people and not second-sourcing. Meltzer could have contacted CM Punk during the whole AEW bullshit. Why didn’t he report Punk’s (true) side?

Speaking of Meltzer, you cannot make this shit up :rofl::rofl::rofl:

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">&quot;This was a very very heavily choreographed gymnastics display that was disguised as a wrestling match.&quot;<br><br>So it’s ok when this happens on AEW all the time, but when Sol Ruca &amp; Kelani Jordan do it it’s “not wrestling” ��<br><br>The hypocrisy is next level <a href="https://t.co/DE7zRgM89T">pic.twitter.com/DE7zRgM89T</a></p>&mdash; Vick (@Vick_8122) <a href="https://twitter.com/Vick_8122/status/1810315562624462971?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">July 8, 2024</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Haven't seen the match, but that seems hilarious

That is amazing.

I agree its not wrestling

"You never see a match like this ANYWHERE..."

Listeners: :shifty: :nono: :roll: :shifty: :roll: :shifty: :roll: :nono:

It seems some of the talent AEW fans thought were going to AEW may have chosen WWE, namely Stephanie Vaquer and The Motor City Machine Guns.

It’s funny to see AEW fans to go from talking about dream matches and what an amazing team MCMG are to things like “10 years too late.”

This :rofl::rofl::rofl:

As the kids from NXT get the athletics down and make it look easy, the attempts to rationalize AEW’s falling place are going to get more and more insane.

I hear there was another bloody beat down segment or something.... is there ever an AEW show that has no blood on it at all?

NXT beat Dynamite in the Key Demo this week. Of course Dave tried to downplay it, wonder why... :rofl:

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Just for the record since people will be fighting about this silliness all day, NXT did 311K in 18-49 Tuesday and AEW did 309K on Wednesday, so it was razor thin.</p>&mdash; Dave Meltzer (@davemeltzerWON) <a href="https://twitter.com/davemeltzerWON/status/1811506926494318692?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">July 11, 2024</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Yep. Fortunately only 691k people watched it.

Lol, he doesn’t feel the need to clarify when Dynamite gets its alleged key demo number rounded up to beat NXT. Another week of this and Dave will have to find something else to trumpet.

I can see Dave going by WWE shows and non-WWE shows, so he can compare NXT to SmackDown and Dynamite to TNA.

Meltzer is cranky that Stephanie Vaquer played AEW like a fiddle and signed with WWE.

I’m pretty sure Tony Khan has a scrapbook of ideas he had when he was 12 and he’s just shoehorning them all into his shows. He debuted a luchador named “Hologram.” A hologram isn’t tangible.

Mom: We have Axiom at home.

Tell that to Jem and The Holograms

WBD would be better off running episodes of Jem and the Holograms.

They’ve started their residency episodes of Collision. I had to watch some clips. Terrible lol. Got quiet Impact Zone vibes. The commentary is horrendous.

The wrestling is so bad. Lots of love taps, obvious cooperation and botches. At least Christian got some belts. Poor guy is ageing carrying this thing on his back though.

If anyone missed it, definitely check out Mariah May’s promo from Dynamite. Fucking amazing lol. From Tony Shiavone slipping and saying “Speak, bitch” to a meandering promo that explained nothing. May also flops on the ground and starts writhing around touching herself at the end (I make that sound better than it is).

TPWW is back up just in time to catch game-changers Shane McMahon, Bobby Lashley and MVP talking to AEW.

Back when there were rumours about Shane going over to AEW.... the peeps on the other board were acting like it wouldn't be the biggest signing since CM Punk.

The first time a McMahon has been signed anywhere else but WWE? That’s a pretty big deal. It’s intriguing, for sure. At least short-term. Who is going to cause a bigger stir — Shane McMahon or Kazuchika Okada? It’s closer to doing something they should do. But they’d no doubt botch it because they’re AEW. The problems are in their very DNA.

Anything Shane could offer on-air he could do better in WWE. If he’s coming in to run the business? Well, he’s a step up from Tony Khan, and he’d probably surround himself with smarter people. But it’s still AEW. There’s a reason WWE hasn’t slotted him into anything important if he wants to get back into wrestling.

Easily the biggest since Punk, but it’d turn into a mess about as fast.

Of course it would, but just saying that he could actually get them a ratings bump for a week or two.

Oh yeah, for sure. You’re 100% right. Not arguing with you there. It’s really him and Goldberg out there as possibilities. And Bill doesn’t seem keen.

The only signing AEW could make that would mean anything would be signing whoever would be Tiny Klown's replacement. Until there, nothing will help.

You’re right, but at what point has the damage been done? People speculate about WBD cutting a deal with AEW if Tony allows for sanctions to be put on his involvement. But when that becomes necessary, at what point do you just stop expecting fruit off the rotten tree?

The wrong guy is in charge, the wrong wrestlers are hired, the wrong “stars” are favored, the wrong stories are executed, the wrong decisions are made at every level. Anything you put into the company is almost an immediate waste. You get Shane or Goldberg for a week and people watch, realize the show sucks, tune out.

I’m actually wondering if TNA comes in and takes the spot on TBS/TNT at this point. They wouldn’t require as much in TV rights and their working relationship with WWE could allow NXT talent to show up and help keep the show fresh. You’d probably get about as many people into a building for a TNA show too.

WBD let their deal with AEW run into non-exclusivity. That implies that either:

a) AEW is trying to acquire a deal outside their scope and WBD doesn’t believe they’re going to get outside offers to justify that.

b) WBD doesn’t want them at all.

The writing was on the wall with this when Tony Khan couldn’t get Ring of Honor television anywhere. If a TV network was even remotely interested in AEW, it would make sense to strike up some sort of deal with TK as a sign of good faith.

It’s also got to be annoying if you’re dealing with Tony Khan and he does a press conference every month talking shop and putting words into your mouth. Eric Bischoff helped seal WCW’s fate the first time he put his feet up on the boardroom table in CNN Tower. Tony helped seal AEW’s fate when he started openly talking about AEW and WBD’s streaming negotiations.

Lol, so for those not following, MJF and Will Ospreay had an hour long match for mid-card belt. MJF won and changed its name from the International Title to the “American Championship.” Now AEW fans are cheering for the heel and Ospreay is cutting horrible damage control promos about the “legacy” of this 2 yr old title that has barely been defended overseas and spent most of its history being held by a guy who mocks wrestling.

I’m pretty sure MJF vs. Will Ospreay was supposed to be for the World Title. Then Tony got wind that people knew why he made Swerve World Champion and how it wasn’t working, so he switched it to Swerve vs. Bryan and MJF vs. Ospreay for the US Title. Why have Ospreay challenge just a PPV before Wembley only to lose before his “big” hometown show?

Britt Baker said something mean that MJF's girlfriend overheard.
MJF enters the women's locker room and chewed Britt out.

AEW suspended Britt, MJF gets no punishment.
Great management! :rofl:

Thought the story was Britt was directly arguing with MJF's girlfriend not that she overheard something....

Britt probably was making her fear for her life, and MJF just defending her....

I haven’t engaged with the whole story, but I did hear something about MJF punching a wall. I think we can agree on one thing:

This is all CM Punk’s fault.

And this is obviously going to be resolved in a timely and efficient manner.

The more I read about Shane possibly going to AEW, the more I want it to happen.

It would be fucking hilarious if he appeared on AEW TV.

I read the opposite. That Britt was talking about MJF in the locker room and his girlfriend overheard and told him, which led to an altercation between Britt and MJF.

Apparently after Britt got yelled at by MJF, she then yelled at the girlfriend to "get out of my locker room."

I guess Will Ospreay also tried to have a conversation with Britt, but nobody could understand anything he was saying, other than "Bruv" and "The Grind" of course, which he said about 87 and 38 times each.

It’s obvious everyone is very happy working there and optimistic about the future of the company.

209k viewers for Rampage.